- 158
- 0
- 16
If they didn't have these inspections, what else would the poor old SWO have to do?!
-
Welcome to the E-Goat :: The Totally Unofficial RAF Rumour Network.
You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
RAF prejudice towards single personnel
- Thread starter EXTCWTG3SAC
- Start date
Witty_Banter
Flight Sergeant
- 1,558
- 22
- 38
I'll try and answer the OP without resorting to statements such as 'dry your eyes princess' or 'suck it up cupcake'; Puma's post summed up pretty well why the blocks still get inspected (OK you're 35, but some of the block inhabitants are barely 18 - and even some of those who are 25+ can barely be trusted not to OD on beer and hurl up 10 pints on the stairwells). It's cheap, communal living, and the rules are written to accommodate the lowest IQ in the military.
In a nutshell, the barrack blocks are the property of the station - the station commander is required to regularly inspect all assets under his or her financial control. The SFAs are NOT under the direct control of the station commander (though he can inspect the surrounding areas, etc, the buildings themselves are under private contract).
The blocks are always on site - SFA are not.
There's also the legal minefield of other service personnel's access to civilian private areas (eg where my wife and kids are). Whilst the blocks are purely military personnel, SFA are not. Although the Stn Cdr cannot access your private area / room without prior warning (he doesn't need your consent, but he can't just walk in whenever he feels like it - that's why the inspections are published in orders).
As others have said, as a singley you are entitled to opt to 'live out', ie pay (substantially higher) rent in private accommodation in a location of your choosing. This is usually only an issue for the youngest members of the forces, as the Stn has a duty of care. More importantly, fill out the FAM survey.
In a nutshell, the barrack blocks are the property of the station - the station commander is required to regularly inspect all assets under his or her financial control. The SFAs are NOT under the direct control of the station commander (though he can inspect the surrounding areas, etc, the buildings themselves are under private contract).
The blocks are always on site - SFA are not.
There's also the legal minefield of other service personnel's access to civilian private areas (eg where my wife and kids are). Whilst the blocks are purely military personnel, SFA are not. Although the Stn Cdr cannot access your private area / room without prior warning (he doesn't need your consent, but he can't just walk in whenever he feels like it - that's why the inspections are published in orders).
As others have said, as a singley you are entitled to opt to 'live out', ie pay (substantially higher) rent in private accommodation in a location of your choosing. This is usually only an issue for the youngest members of the forces, as the Stn has a duty of care. More importantly, fill out the FAM survey.
- 2,950
- 1
- 38
As has been said by may the station has a duty of care to all single personnel. Having investigated many gastroenteritis outbreaks poor standards in communal living does have an impact it is also an opportunity to possibly identify individuals that are struggling or have issues from a welfare/mental health perspective. Having spent my fair share of time in single accommodation I can also report a number of 'horror' stories as the the state of the block after alcohol related merriment. It is also an important life skill as many of us have had to deploy and live in very small areas and if you cannot keep your personal admin squared away then your tent mates may apply remedial action far worse than a SWO will dish out.
As to FMQ's we do get inspected with safety checks carried out every 6 months and they will check the cleanliness of cookers as it is part of the checks. If you don't look after your FMQ then any damage that requires fixing you will be billed for and often if families are involved then a minging quarter or poor home life will often show in how children are dressed, if they are clean, their behaviour etc which will then get welfare/social services involved.
As has already been highlighted we have to pay all our bills, TV licence, furniture etc. In some of the SLAM accommodation I have seen the furniture an communal living spaces are better than my house! The military/station have forked out to improve single living and so as the 'landlord' they are well within their rights to make sure that their investment is not getting trashed.
As to FMQ's we do get inspected with safety checks carried out every 6 months and they will check the cleanliness of cookers as it is part of the checks. If you don't look after your FMQ then any damage that requires fixing you will be billed for and often if families are involved then a minging quarter or poor home life will often show in how children are dressed, if they are clean, their behaviour etc which will then get welfare/social services involved.
As has already been highlighted we have to pay all our bills, TV licence, furniture etc. In some of the SLAM accommodation I have seen the furniture an communal living spaces are better than my house! The military/station have forked out to improve single living and so as the 'landlord' they are well within their rights to make sure that their investment is not getting trashed.
SAXAVORDIAN
Sergeant
- 652
- 46
- 28
Well you could always do permanent Nightshift as that would stop room inspection but still be subject for bull duty.
DT_Xtremez_30:.
Seriously though this is part of the discipline to ensure you maintain your part of the bargain. Regardless were you are posted. If a CO see discipline on a small station being slack he could have bullnight as many as he wishes been there done that and got the t shirt.ban please
DT_Xtremez_30:.Seriously though this is part of the discipline to ensure you maintain your part of the bargain. Regardless were you are posted. If a CO see discipline on a small station being slack he could have bullnight as many as he wishes been there done that and got the t shirt.ban please
PraiseBacon
Sergeant
- 740
- 2
- 18
A few points to chip in, albeit it has been over 20 years since I last lived in a Jr ranks block.
First point – landlord inspection. I own a house that I rent out – it is managed by a local agent who inspects it every 6 months for me. This helps me stay on top of maintenance and ensure the tenants are not doing anything stupid / causing damage to my house etc.
MQ’s get formal inspections at set points, mostly march in or out.
It is not unreasonable for the landlords representative (SWO etc.) to inspect the single accommodation. Certainly in the 80’s ad 90‘s we were living in some very old blocks, and the inspection often lead to maintenance requests being filled out.
Unless recruitment has changed dramatically – there will still be a wide variety of people living in Jr ranks blocks, some very responsible and able to look after themselves – and some will still be immature (young, stupid, etc) – an inspection forces them to clean up occasionally – as well as gives an indication of any problems (is there evidence of damage, of them being bullied, etc).
I’ve known inspections to range from a general walk through – to a full on white gloves and checking underside of bedframes for dust. The former makes sense – the latter is overzealous and hopefully less common nowadays.
Also, all things being equal, once someone has been in a few years – there is a reasonable chance they will get promoted and live in the SNCO block (most trades anyway!), where the inspections don’t happen.
Also, as people mature, they often live off base (i did most of the time for early 20’s onwards, even in places like Cyprus)
Point being, sensible inspections of Jr accom are not that big an issue, IMO, and certainly not a sign of being prejudice against single people. And is the nausea of it happening occasionally is a pain you don’t want to live with due to being more mature - exercise your right to live off base
First point – landlord inspection. I own a house that I rent out – it is managed by a local agent who inspects it every 6 months for me. This helps me stay on top of maintenance and ensure the tenants are not doing anything stupid / causing damage to my house etc.
MQ’s get formal inspections at set points, mostly march in or out.
It is not unreasonable for the landlords representative (SWO etc.) to inspect the single accommodation. Certainly in the 80’s ad 90‘s we were living in some very old blocks, and the inspection often lead to maintenance requests being filled out.
Unless recruitment has changed dramatically – there will still be a wide variety of people living in Jr ranks blocks, some very responsible and able to look after themselves – and some will still be immature (young, stupid, etc) – an inspection forces them to clean up occasionally – as well as gives an indication of any problems (is there evidence of damage, of them being bullied, etc).
I’ve known inspections to range from a general walk through – to a full on white gloves and checking underside of bedframes for dust. The former makes sense – the latter is overzealous and hopefully less common nowadays.
Also, all things being equal, once someone has been in a few years – there is a reasonable chance they will get promoted and live in the SNCO block (most trades anyway!), where the inspections don’t happen.
Also, as people mature, they often live off base (i did most of the time for early 20’s onwards, even in places like Cyprus)
Point being, sensible inspections of Jr accom are not that big an issue, IMO, and certainly not a sign of being prejudice against single people. And is the nausea of it happening occasionally is a pain you don’t want to live with due to being more mature - exercise your right to live off base
Whilst O/Sgt at Wyton I accompanied the O/O as his orders atated he was to check a Barrack room at random.
I couldn't believe the terrible state of some of the rooms - open dustbins - motorbike engines etc. mostly unmade beds - empty beer cans. The O/O told me we would find a half decent one, which we did with difficulty, and note we had checked that one at random.
Whilst living in as a Cpl I noticed how many outstanding MPBW jobs were completed just before the CO's inspection.
If there were no inspections of the Barrack Blocks they would deteriorate into major health/fire hazards.
I couldn't believe the terrible state of some of the rooms - open dustbins - motorbike engines etc. mostly unmade beds - empty beer cans. The O/O told me we would find a half decent one, which we did with difficulty, and note we had checked that one at random.
Whilst living in as a Cpl I noticed how many outstanding MPBW jobs were completed just before the CO's inspection.
If there were no inspections of the Barrack Blocks they would deteriorate into major health/fire hazards.
Having been a JNCO I/C a block I can confirm from my experience that indeed the main reason to inspect was to force through work services etc and carry out fire inspections/extinguisher checks.
Witty_Banter
Flight Sergeant
- 1,558
- 22
- 38
On a lighter note - at 35, perhaps if you were to move into rented accommodation rather than 'the blocks', it may help with your other 'issue'...just saying...
EXTCWTG3SAC
LAC
- 53
- 0
- 0
Some of your replies are missing the point. Why are married personnel in service accommodation exempt from SWO and Station Comander inspections with the potential of disciplinary action placed on them when single personnel living in service accommodation are not. Why should I be given disciplinary action for an untidy room when my married counterpart will never get his rooms in his married quarters service accommodation inspected. I know that the block could be entitled as a communal living area but my room is not a communal living area so why should my room be tidied for inspection.
EXTCWTG3SAC
LAC
- 53
- 0
- 0
It may seem to some of you that I am going over the top but my point is valid. Married personnel in service accommodation are not subject to routine SWO and Station Commander inspection so why am I as a singly living in service accommodation subjected to routine inspections. You cant use the excuse 'well we cant bother families and children and their living space' because that doesn't cut with me. At the end of the day married personnel are living in service owned accommodation so they should be subject to routine inspection just the same as every singly living on camp.
EXTCWTG3SAC
LAC
- 53
- 0
- 0
Also just to add I am not trying to form an argument for single personnel to get out of block inspections, my argument is that married personnel in service accommodation should also be subject to routine SWO and Station Commander inspections because at the moment single personnel living in service accommodation are predjudiced against with regards to this matter.
EXTCWTG3SAC
LAC
- 53
- 0
- 0
Another thing. During SWO and Station Commander insepctions one of the things checked for are TV licences in single rooms with disciplinary action taken against those without valid TV licences. Where are the measures in place to ensure that married personnel in married quarters have valid TV licences? Why are married quarters not subject to TV licence inspections? See where I am getting at? One rule for single personnel and another for married personnel.
Married quarters do have inspections for TV licenses and disciplinary action is taken if you use a TV and don't have one. Google it!
Not sure if you're just a bad troll or just retarded, I'm hoping it's the former.
I think you miss the point. It's not one rule for single and one for married. It's simply rules depending on where you choose to live. You don't HAVE to live in SLA
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
MattBombHead
Sergeant
- 919
- 0
- 16
I'm sure its been mentioned further up the thread, but MQs are NOT owned by the MoD anymore - they were sold off years ago to a civilian company to 'manage'.
Kryten
Warrant Officer
- 4,266
- 206
- 63
Not sure if things have changed since I left, but one of the reasons why TV Licences were required for block inspections was because the TV Detector vans of Yore could drive around MQs freely - as they couldn't get onto camps for various reasons presentation at an inspection was the only way to ensure that airmen were within the law.
needsabiggerfuse
Flight Sergeant
- 1,880
- 0
- 0
Try living in MQ without a valid TV licence. It won't be long before a man with a clipboard comes calling. The previous tenant in one quarter we lived in didn't. We marched in and transferred our licence as per normal. Unfortunately the bureaucracy took time to catch up, but we still had the knock on the door.
- 12,275
- 461
- 83
I have a view...
If you are a filthy SAC or lower (JT's don't count anymore) and living in the block then you're going to get turned over about every 6 months. If you're a filthy rat then the block NCO is going to know this and he's going to hammer you until you change your ways. If you're an inky swot with home-made curtain tie backs etc then he'll just poke his head through if even at all.
I feel for the CPL's in all this. Its a rank that has lost a deal of its power and prestige. Some times CPL's are in the block because of divorce or a posting in an area with high rent or house prices so they don't have much choice but they shouldn't have to receive the same treatment as the ranks below him. He/she is a JNCO and should get some concessions for that IMO in terms of having privacy invaded.
People in married quarters. As previously mentioned by others there are periodical inspections and the big expensive one when marching out. Some quarter must be given to the wife and bin-lids who are not in uniform and must be allowed some semblance of normality, as they were used to before marrying into it. Also wives when husbands are deployed have bigger worries that if the bed is made or floors hovered...Single parenting miles from grandparents I can vouch is hard work and the other half isn't always guaranteed in recent times to return so I think in reflection the balance is right.
If you are a filthy SAC or lower (JT's don't count anymore) and living in the block then you're going to get turned over about every 6 months. If you're a filthy rat then the block NCO is going to know this and he's going to hammer you until you change your ways. If you're an inky swot with home-made curtain tie backs etc then he'll just poke his head through if even at all.
I feel for the CPL's in all this. Its a rank that has lost a deal of its power and prestige. Some times CPL's are in the block because of divorce or a posting in an area with high rent or house prices so they don't have much choice but they shouldn't have to receive the same treatment as the ranks below him. He/she is a JNCO and should get some concessions for that IMO in terms of having privacy invaded.
People in married quarters. As previously mentioned by others there are periodical inspections and the big expensive one when marching out. Some quarter must be given to the wife and bin-lids who are not in uniform and must be allowed some semblance of normality, as they were used to before marrying into it. Also wives when husbands are deployed have bigger worries that if the bed is made or floors hovered...Single parenting miles from grandparents I can vouch is hard work and the other half isn't always guaranteed in recent times to return so I think in reflection the balance is right.
- 4,600
- 643
- 113
It has been said - numerous times. The OP didn't see it because the answer doesn't fit into his agenda.
In the line of my work, I have been to many Junior Rank SLA rooms following a request from the SWO/BB Custodian to give my take on the state of the rooms and can fully appreciate why these inspection occur, however I am going to play devils advocate and ask, when was the last time a SNCO was subject to a room inspection.
You think they should know better? Trust me they dont!!
Ive known a CMC be forced to close/lock up a communal kitchen in a SNCOs Mess because the grots couldnt keep it clean. Ive also known the same Mess remove bins from the communal kitchens because the grots would empty their own bins into it on a friday (usually containing food) knowing full well it would stay there all weekend stinking. What happened? The scruffy lazy gits started throwing food waste out of the kitchen window. I kid you not!
Ive also been to communal areas in "God Forbid" the Officers Mess to find similar states and a quick chat with the batting ladies quickly confirms how some of our lords and masters choose to live.
Whilst the OP's point is a little "confused" with regards to the whole single/married issue (married folk do actually sometimes need to live in JR SLA) I do think there is disparity between ranks when it comes to SLA being inspected.
Also those of you giving this guy grief for his age and still living in SLA, you have no idea of his personal circumstances so wind it in.
I am all for these inspections continuing but hey lets share the wealth and ensure all SLA in inspected.
You think they should know better? Trust me they dont!!
Ive known a CMC be forced to close/lock up a communal kitchen in a SNCOs Mess because the grots couldnt keep it clean. Ive also known the same Mess remove bins from the communal kitchens because the grots would empty their own bins into it on a friday (usually containing food) knowing full well it would stay there all weekend stinking. What happened? The scruffy lazy gits started throwing food waste out of the kitchen window. I kid you not!
Ive also been to communal areas in "God Forbid" the Officers Mess to find similar states and a quick chat with the batting ladies quickly confirms how some of our lords and masters choose to live.
Whilst the OP's point is a little "confused" with regards to the whole single/married issue (married folk do actually sometimes need to live in JR SLA) I do think there is disparity between ranks when it comes to SLA being inspected.
Also those of you giving this guy grief for his age and still living in SLA, you have no idea of his personal circumstances so wind it in.
I am all for these inspections continuing but hey lets share the wealth and ensure all SLA in inspected.