Kinloss MRT to move to Lossie...

[Teh Wal]

According to the BBC news site Kinloss MRT are moving across to Lossie on the 26th of this month!? Has anyone told Kinloss MRT? -- http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-18752720

Coming so soon on the back of the NDT team being booted off ISK too!

 

[techie_tubby]

Can someone clearly define what is actually happening with Kinloss please? Is the camp completely closing? Is it re-rolling to an Army Garrison with the airfield staying RAF so that SAR can operate? Is it all going Army with SAR relocating to ISK?

 

[Joe_90]

It's being transferred to the Navy as a static aircraft carrier!

 

[vim_fuego]

How many are still stationed there and more importantly why? What is their exit plan?

It's a station at the end of a long supply run with no portfolio expect a couple of lodger units...

 

[Teh Wal]

Can someone clearly define what is actually happening with Kinloss please? Is the camp completely closing? Is it re-rolling to an Army Garrison with the airfield staying RAF so that SAR can operate? Is it all going Army with SAR relocating to ISK?

SAR (if you mean 202 Sqn) aren't at ISK, they are and have been across at ISL for the post 20-umpty years.
As far as I can make out the ARCC will be the the only RAF lodger unit remaining when the Ensign comes down for the last time at 1200 on the 26th July. Apparently the airfield/runways will be maintained as a relief landing ground for ISL. The Green boys will raise their flag directly after ours comes down.

 

[techie_tubby]

SAR (if you mean 202 Sqn) aren't at ISK, they are and have been across at ISL for the post 20-umpty years.

Ahhh my mistake, what elements of SAR are at Kinloss if any? Is it just the control centre?

 

[Flybynight]

It's being transferred to the Navy as a static aircraft carrier!

When I were a lad ISL was the static aircraft carrier ('RN School of Advanced Flying,' the FAA answer to Valley)and ISK was a 19 Group, Coastal Command base flying MR Shackletons. The RCC now at ISL was at Pitreavie Castle, near Dunfirmline, Fife, with another at Mount Batten, Plymouth. SAR was carried out by Whirlwinds converted from piston to turboprop.

 

[vim_fuego]

When I were a lad ISL was the static aircraft carrier ('RN School of Advanced Flying,' the FAA answer to Valley)and ISK was a 19 Group, Coastal Command base flying MR Shackletons. The RCC now at ISL was at Pitreavie Castle, near Dunfirmline, Fife, with another at Mount Batten, Plymouth. SAR was carried out by Whirlwinds converted from piston to turboprop.

The ARCC is at ISK.

 

[techie_tubby]

The ARCC is at ISK.

Not to be confused with ARRC that was at JHQ and then moved to Innsworth. God we love our acronyms! DT_Xtremez_42:

 

[Flybynight]

The ARCC is at ISK.

You're right, failure to engage brain before operating key pad, well my brain hurts with all these acronyms (I can't make head or tail of most of the pongo ones)!

I suggest a single, rotating station, to be called RAF Kinlossiemouth, that can be dismantled, transported round the old Coastal Command sites and re-erected wherever it's wanted within 48 hours.

DT_Xtremez_44:

[Sent from my clapped-out PC using a dusty key pad]

 

[Teh Wal]

... SAR was carried out by Whirlwinds converted from piston to turboprop.

Turboshaft sir, turboshaft.
I like your idea about RAf Kinlossiemouth... it kinda ties in with the thinking of the people at the top who are currently doing an excellent job of reverse engineering the latest aircraft carriers so that they aren't capable of carrying aircraft.

 

[Stevienics]

According to the BBC news site Kinloss MRT are moving across to Lossie on the 26th of this month!? Has anyone told Kinloss MRT? -- http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-18752720

Coming so soon on the back of the NDT team being booted off ISK too!

They could move KMRT to the moon, they could never be as good as the mighty behemoths of Saints.

 

[Flybynight]

Turboshaft sir, turboshaft.

I sit corrected, sir!

I like your idea about RAf Kinlossiemouth... it kinda ties in with the thinking of the people at the top who are currently doing an excellent job of reverse engineering the latest aircraft carriers so that they aren't capable of carrying aircraft.

It gets more like Marvel Comics by the minute. It's a good job we've got Boris on his bike to defend us all: "Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's SUPERBORIS!"

stfu

[Sent from my thing using wotsit]

 

[snowball1]

They could move KMRT to the moon, they could never be as good as the mighty behemoths of Saints.

The only MRT who take suits with them on a weekend!

 

[Shiney Scot]

I know they do a good job but do we still need them? After the latest round of redundancies is there still a requirement to have a small dedicated team supplemented by volunteers? Surely this small team would be better off back in trade. After all, the majority of call outs must be to rescue idiots on hills rather than the primary cause of downed aircrew. Privatise all rescues for non downed military aircraft!

 

[Stevienics]

I know they do a good job but do we still need them? After the latest round of redundancies is there still a requirement to have a small dedicated team supplemented by volunteers? Surely this small team would be better off back in trade. After all, the majority of call outs must be to rescue idiots on hills rather than the primary cause of downed aircrew. Privatise all rescues for non downed military aircraft!

Good point, but it's a NATO obligation - and costs next to nothing to run. Anyhow, all this "dedicated team" do is pretty much make sure that everyting is ready to go. The numbers, muscle and brains are in the volunteers.

 

[Climebear]

I know they do a good job but do we still need them? After the latest round of redundancies is there still a requirement to have a small dedicated team supplemented by volunteers? Surely this small team would be better off back in trade. After all, the majority of call outs must be to rescue idiots on hills rather than the primary cause of downed aircrew. Privatise all rescues for non downed military aircraft!

Even if we could pursuade the (unpaid volunteer) civilian MRTs to do the land-based SAR for military aircrew (or indeed the requirement for military personnel worldwide) there would still be a requirement for the RAF to provide a crash guard to secure a crash scene for both evidence and for the safety of the public.

At the moment the MRTs cover that task (for crashes further than 5 miles from an airfield) for the first 24-48 hours following a crash. This enables the station responsible for the Post Crash Management of the area to generate it's crash gaurd. Take away the MRTs and each station would need to have a crash guard on a shorter notice to move (1 hour). As aircraft have an annoying tendency to crash in inhospitable places (remember the F15s that crashed in the Cairngorms) these individuals would need to be equiped and trained to operate in these environments. So rather than 4 MRTs at current - each station with a post crash management responsibility would need to have a dedicated team of crash guards trained and equiped on 1 hour's notice to move.

 

[XVR RA RA RA]

there would still be a requirement for the RAF to provide a crash guard to secure a crash scene for both evidence and for the safety of the public.
.

What requirement is this? If Joe Public wants to walk his dog straight through the crash site, what can you do about it to stop him?

In today's world the civvy teams are very capable of doing things on their own. I wonder how many callouts they have every year, where they don't need you?

 

[FatDrunkAndStupid]

What requirement is this? If Joe Public wants to walk his dog straight through the crash site, what can you do about it to stop him?

In today's world the civvy teams are very capable of doing things on their own. I wonder how many callouts they have every year, where they don't need you?

You prevent him or get the police to prevent him from doing so (If there is one). Thats why its called "A Crash Guard"
Responsibilites are here: https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...RvpJ_s&sig=AHIEtbSBKhWoIky0oGFoNEmpdg9QnuaciA

 

[Climebear]

What requirement is this? If Joe Public wants to walk his dog straight through the crash site, what can you do about it to stop him?

In today's world the civvy teams are very capable of doing things on their own. I wonder how many callouts they have every year, where they don't need you?

The Military Aviation Authority's Aircraft Post Crash Management (APCM) Aide Memoir (available on the intranet) details the requirements.

Turning to your specific question, a member of a cordon party (be they MRTs (initially) or Stn PCM Guard Force) has no powers to prevent a member of the public entering the crash site - they can advise against it. If a member of the public does decide to ignore their advice then the cordon party can contact the attending civpol (normally colocated with the site ICP) who can prevent memebrs of the public (including the land owner) as the crash site is subject to The Military Remains Act 1986:

s.1: All aircraft which have crashed in military service whether at land or sea are protected and “It is an offence to tamper/damage/move or unearth any remains unless the S of S has issued a licence to do so”

Civilian teams are extremely good; however, I would suggest (having worked extensively with them) that they would not wish to hang around after the life-saving phase of a SAR operation is complete just to guard a crash site in order that the MOD can meet its legal obligation under Health and Safety at Work legislation to protect members of the public from the hazards present at an aircraft accident site.