You mean Tornado abort rates have suddenly halved?
It has been modified to the required standards?
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You mean Tornado abort rates have suddenly halved?
It has been modified to the required standards?
Its doing as good a job, including things the harrier couldn't, if you weren't so far out of the loop you'd know.
Far too many people believe all they see in the press which is slanted to suit a certain dark blue agenda.
Actually I know of one bit of kit that has been taken out the loop which was responsible for the majority of aborted sorties which the tonka leckies amongst us know about...
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Off Topic I don't know what it is! Must have been out of the loop for too long.
DT_Xtremez_14:Guess I'll just stick to ultra modern airliners then :raf:
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...Is it the Inbox?
Webbo
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Yup, SMS (Stores Management System), PDU, dialling out blah blah, not as many crew-outs.....................
DT_Xtremez_30:
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JBJ90
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Tha ability to take off with a full fuel and weapon load in the heat? That would be nice.
Having watched the Tonkas on Discovery, I noted that they were carrying less than the Harrier and although able to get off the ground I have heard they're struggling to get off the ground, standby to be corrected on that one.
DT_Xtremez_42:Now I'm not slating the tonka because I personally hate the bloody thing, but you can't justify the decision by stating Tornado is a better choice.
It's not, end of....
DT_Xtremez_06:Harrier could be fitted with Brimstone and could be fitted with Stormshadow (have seen the pictures from the BAE trial) with funding.
Harrier wasn't perfect but it could do the job and do it well. It doesn't need as long a runway, or even an airfield, could take off with power to spare with a full load, needs less manpower to support it in theatre, and it's the only dedicated CAS aircraft in our arsenal.
As for the cost argument of saving a billion, Tonka will cost seven times that to maintain it's service life.
The only reason Tornado won out is numbers and the officers making the calls most likely came from a
Tornado background merely because there is more of them, I know this but it's still a bitter pill to swallow
and this decision will come back to haunt us.
DT_Xtremez_42:Having actually fitted a stormshadow to a Harrier I can comment on this. Physical it would fit, however disconnecting the outrigger Oleo and jacking the A/C to fit the store is not very practical, nor is the fact that it couldn't land with a stormshadow fitted not to mention CoG problems in flight. So in reality it was never going to happen and isn't a feasible option.
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Combet Sheep
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Tornado can keep going till about 2025 to take into account the future delays on JSF DT_Xtremez_14:
DT_Xtremez_14:You really have no appreciation of my job so rather than making yourself look foolish with comments like the above maybe you should keep quiet, just as I don't make sweeping generalisations of your job/career.
Harrier could be fitted with Brimstone and could be fitted with Stormshadow (have seen the pictures from the BAE trial) with funding.
Harrier wasn't perfect but it could do the job and do it well. It doesn't need as long a runway, or even an airfield, could take off with power to spare with a full load, needs less manpower to support it in theatre, and it's the only dedicated CAS aircraft in our arsenal.
As for the cost argument of saving a billion, Tonka will cost seven times that to maintain it's service life.
The only reason Tornado won out is numbers and the officers making the calls most likely came from a
Tornado background merely because there is more of them, I know this but it's still a bitter pill to swallow
and this decision will come back to haunt us.
Tonkas can and do take off with a full load of weapons and fuel, manpower is pretty much the same, harrier isn't dedicated CAS anymore than a tonka is, everything is multirole nowadays.
I think you underestimate the numbers issue, if you want a 5 sqn gr force what do you do? Cut tonkas by 2 or somehow magic 2 extra gr9s from nowhere?
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I saw some of the early trials of CASOM on the Harrier with wooden and weighted mock ups of the various weapon designs at the time.
As DS says, the practicalities of loading it aside, the fact that the operation of the secondary flying controls and CofG were seriously impaired put the idea to bed. (Well, until stormshadow came along. They obviously forgot the previous lessons
DT_Xtremez_42TW
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I dont like them either, but the tonka does have two seats for all that mission capability stuff!
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Sure. Corden must weight 20 stone.