More reductions

[Tin basher]

OK it's the Mail so there could be some journalistic licence but.

Army 'faces cuts of 10,000 soldiers' in audit next month

Experts fear the Integrated Review, which is due to be delivered next month, will call for the Army to be reduced to 72,000 soldiers - despite Government pledges to keep a permanent force of 82,000.

www.dailymail.co.uk

"Serving soldiers are being offered up to £12,000 – to persuade musicians to enlist .......this is the first time the Royal Corps of Army Music – which is made up of 14 bands, 753 musicians and 27 training teams – has had to offer incentives"

753 musicians and 27 training teams in 2021 WTF

 

[Rugby-Jock-Lad]

Completely agree. Find the BARMY can't let got of a lot of "surplus to requirement" traditions. Big Sis was Central Band Cranners before I joined and that was THE band for the RAF and still is I believe. Not a fan of cuts but the Army still don't get it..................

 

[Rugby-Jock-Lad]

....Also to add!!!

And the Mass numbers of TOP BRASS at MOD/Commands???????????????

 

[busby1971]

Smaller than the Airforce I joined.

 

[Stevienics]

It's largely their own fault. You plan for bang for buck capability, not how many smart young men you can put on a square of tarmac every morning.

 

[Tin basher]

Not a fan of cuts but the Army still don't get it..................

They certainly appear not have grasped what reduction actually means. They have 753 musicians and 485 horses currently serving and the total number of Challenger 2 Main Battle Tanks is 227.

Leading The Charge: Twice As Many Horses As Tanks In British Army

Amid ongoing changes to the British Army under the banner of austerity, the bemusing statistic of four legged firepower outweighing the heavy metal va

www.forces.net

 

[fourteen2two]

Obviously musicians are more important than front line troops

 

[muttywhitedog]

Surely after the year we've endured, its now time to completely bin off the ceremonial elements.

I cant recall anyone saying how they've missed a good parade in 2020. Family, friends, holidays, trips out, shaking hands, hugging, etc - yes, but a parade.....

 

[fourteen2two]

The Army does seem somewhat obsessed with drill and ceremony. One reason I joined the RAF!
Certainly I didn't look forward to parades etc. Necessary part of service life.
The older ones among us will probably remember all the cleaning and bullshit that accompanied the AOCs inspection.

 

[Rugby-Jock-Lad]

One has to remember that the BArmy has endemic problems...recruitment, bullying, poor(er) management, top heavy...so the B5 is a way of (trying and failing) hiding that. Problem is in this day of 24 hour journalism, open forums etc they have been exposed and despite a clear, regular hammering have adopted a bunker mentality believing their problems will go away somehow...........

 

[Barch]

To put it bluntly the Army Top Brass are too fúcking stupid to manage a large organisation.

 

[Late & Tired]

Without wanting to de-rail the primary green thread, and not wanting another "All aboard scrapping the RAFAT Bus", I wonder if the Reds are under scrutiny yet again and, if so, does the current public and military purse have the appetite to continue funding them.?
At the end of the day, it's 12+ pilots, a squadron of engineers and support trades which could be dispersed to needy areas...

 

[muttywhitedog]

I was under the impression that the cost to the MOD in keeping the Red Arrows is covered by the amount received in increased tax revenues from companies who have networked at RAFAT-attended events.

If the MOD are serious about cutting costs they should scrap separate messes and bin the Steward trade.

That would save more more than the Reds cost. But it would also mean officers & SNCOs having to take their own plate to a washing area.

 

[Oldstacker]

One of the issues with the army is that the officers, in particular, have it drilled into them that loyalty to the regiment or corps is everything so no senior officer is ever going to countenance cuts to 'their' cap badges. There are too many 'we're special and do things differently' organisations - take a look at QRs (Army) for examples of that. Working in a tri-service organisation is actually like working in a 10 service organisation at times.
The most senior officers in the Army tend to come from 'elite' (or elitist) or traditional cap badges such as the Guards or cavalry regiments rather than corps such as the RLC or AGC and direct things accordingly.

The other aspect that needs clarity is "what is the purpose of the ceremonial functions and who is benefitting?" Are they performed for the benefit of the army and therefore should be paid for from the Army's budget in competition with other tasks or are they 'state ceremonial' and should be more clearly funded as being separate to 'proper' defence spending. I would assume that the different budget allocations are clear within MOD but are always obscured when journo's and the public get to discussing the merits and costs of horses vs tanks.

 

[Stevienics]

Without wanting to de-rail the primary green thread, and not wanting another "All aboard scrapping the RAFAT Bus", I wonder if the Reds are under scrutiny yet again and, if so, does the current public and military purse have the appetite to continue funding them.?
At the end of the day, it's 12+ pilots, a squadron of engineers and support trades which could be dispersed to needy areas...

Times are changing, as are the traditional magnets of recruitment of excellence such as RAFAT - expectations have changed. However, it's still an important bugle to many stakeholders.

 

[StickyFingers]

If the MOD are serious about cutting costs they should scrap separate messes and bin the Steward trade.

I say this every chance I get. In these times of inclusivity and cost-saving why have 3 separates bars and food halls? it's a no brainer. Plus the quality of food will go up.

Maybe have separate messes for trainees on training camps, but everywhere else, get it combined.

Oh and get rid of all that Army ceremonial lot. And make them do all the MACA and Yellowhammer type stuff.

 

[Quagmire]

Without wanting to de-rail the primary green thread, and not wanting another "All aboard scrapping the RAFAT Bus", I wonder if the Reds are under scrutiny yet again and, if so, does the current public and military purse have the appetite to continue funding them.?
At the end of the day, it's 12+ pilots, a squadron of engineers and support trades which could be dispersed to needy areas...

There is a FOI request about RAFAT costs.

 

[Vushtrri]

I say this every chance I get. In these times of inclusivity and cost-saving why have 3 separates bars and food halls? it's a no brainer. Plus the quality of food will go up.

Maybe have separate messes for trainees on training camps, but everywhere else, get it combined.

Oh and get rid of all that Army ceremonial lot. And make them do all the MACA and Yellowhammer type stuff

Totally agree..after all, what goes in one end all ends up coming out of the other and into the same sewer irrespective of what mess you’re in, so shorten the trip and have everyone the same mess.

 

[Downsizer]

The idea of binning messes is great, but to be fair the mere sight of a junior rank makes me feel physically sick these days, so there is no way I want to eat near one of the plebs.

 

[Oldstacker]

Plus the quality of food will go up.

That's what they said about PAYD.....

I have eaten in a number of Officers' & Seniors' messes (and some combined eateries) of all 3 services in recent years, the differences are less about the quality of the food per se but more about the ambience and service style. For me, the positive about separate messes is that they give promotion an added benefit in terms of comfort and style. It shouldn't just be about money in the pocket.

And (as Downsizer alludes), we have in all the services a wide range of people from the highly educated &, frankly, 'civilised' to the basic general purpose grunt for whom knife & fork are difficult concepts. I'm not sure that 'levelling up' is what will occur,....