Sorry Trumpton, you will be on a hiding to nothing here. We are all aware that Fire is nasty, as is Chemicals, Fuel, Falling Buildings and the Myriad of other things you have to deal with. Our point is, your union let you down as did all those members who supported strike action and I include 1977 and all the other little strikes since. You guys signed on to do a (heroic in some cases) job and then stood back and let a bunch of militant, "look at me, I can bring the country to a halt" ferkwits in charge of your union bring you and your genuine collegues down to the level of scum. They knew full well that the military would be called upon to cover you job, and whilst I agree we are not experts, the basic training was enough for us to keep on top of things. Over the years I and my collegues have been binmen, ambulance drivers, picked up the remains at Lockerbie and covered a few conflicts here and there. All we try to point out is, why did you join the FB, the money?, the shifts?, the calender work?, or was it to make a difference and save lives? You and your workmates need to sort your priorities. By the way 28 years so far, FB 1st strike action, 1977, that was me in the back of the Goddess!
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T
trumpton basher
Guest
I certainly didn't come here for sympathy. We made our choices and we will live and die by them. I came on here because on of your members posted on a non-political Firefighters forum, and I came here to answer a few questions never intending or indeed hoping to win the hearts and minds of the membership here.
The original post was a somewhat (and has been accepted as such) humorous and exageratted view of how some people (not neccessarily yourselves) paint our job, just to prompt a debate. We are not angels but generally a decent and regular group of people going about there job if viewed objectively...and I'm sure if it hadn't of been for the recent dispute most of you would not have had an opinion in any direction about the service...apart from the one or two of you who were affected by the first dispute back in the 70's.
I think I've said about all I can on the subject, like I said not trying to elicit sympathy or acceptance of what went on...just giving you the facts from someone who was there and didn't ask to be there.
If you have any genuine concerns or questions about the Fire Service then feel free to join the UK Fire Service forum, where among Firefighting professionals from across the Industry (LA wholetime & Retained, CAA, Industrial & Military) you will get an answer to your question.
If on the other hand you feel you want to carry on with a subjective slanging match then I'm sure you will get appropriate engagement on the UK-fire.net site.
Thank you for having me and good luck and stay safe wherever you find yourselves.
The original post was a somewhat (and has been accepted as such) humorous and exageratted view of how some people (not neccessarily yourselves) paint our job, just to prompt a debate. We are not angels but generally a decent and regular group of people going about there job if viewed objectively...and I'm sure if it hadn't of been for the recent dispute most of you would not have had an opinion in any direction about the service...apart from the one or two of you who were affected by the first dispute back in the 70's.
I think I've said about all I can on the subject, like I said not trying to elicit sympathy or acceptance of what went on...just giving you the facts from someone who was there and didn't ask to be there.
If you have any genuine concerns or questions about the Fire Service then feel free to join the UK Fire Service forum, where among Firefighting professionals from across the Industry (LA wholetime & Retained, CAA, Industrial & Military) you will get an answer to your question.
If on the other hand you feel you want to carry on with a subjective slanging match then I'm sure you will get appropriate engagement on the UK-fire.net site.
Thank you for having me and good luck and stay safe wherever you find yourselves.
C
CrabAirsoles
Guest
Yeah, and stag on.
fat lazy techie
Flight Sergeant
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It's nice to see some spokesperson said the firefighters tried all possible means to avoid todays walkout. I say bolarks!!!!!!
If they didn't want to walk out then just don't do it!!!! SIMPLE.
But no, instead it's the ever overstretched armed forces that get reamed again.
I have a novel idea, how about the whinging firefighters go out to the hot sandy place, get shot at and mortared, face the very real threat of suicide bombers, live in tents that are well past their usefull life and work their nuts off in the heat, all for the same wages as some poor squaddie. Somehow I don't think they would take up the offer.
Yes I knew what I was signing up for when I joined up, as did they, but I just get on with my job (even though I have the odd gripe now and then).
Rant over (for now)
If they didn't want to walk out then just don't do it!!!! SIMPLE.
But no, instead it's the ever overstretched armed forces that get reamed again.
I have a novel idea, how about the whinging firefighters go out to the hot sandy place, get shot at and mortared, face the very real threat of suicide bombers, live in tents that are well past their usefull life and work their nuts off in the heat, all for the same wages as some poor squaddie. Somehow I don't think they would take up the offer.
Yes I knew what I was signing up for when I joined up, as did they, but I just get on with my job (even though I have the odd gripe now and then).
Rant over (for now)
B
Barney mc grew
Guest
I have read with interest all the arguments for and against the West mids FF strike.
It seems to me that some valid points have been made on both sides and i find it sad that grown men are entering a slanging match about something either side knows very little of the other.
All i can say is as a serving Firefighter is we are sorry that it involves you lads to cover for us.
We appreciate it on the other hand 'cos no one wants anyone to get hurt because of our action.
During the last dispute we did have a good rapport with the military lads in our area and regularly took them food and drink that was donated to us on the picket line, they seemed to understand and sympathise, and they could see we were genuinely gratefull for their cover for us.
You have to undestand this dispute is only happening as a last resort, the management have got their hob nailed boots on and are stamping all over us.
The so called improvements they are bringing in are nothing more than ways to get at the workforce with bullying, it's not about money and greed.
i would have thought that you lads would understand that you have to fight for what you beleive in.
Sorry Lads but we are up against the wall, Stay safe.
It seems to me that some valid points have been made on both sides and i find it sad that grown men are entering a slanging match about something either side knows very little of the other.
All i can say is as a serving Firefighter is we are sorry that it involves you lads to cover for us.
We appreciate it on the other hand 'cos no one wants anyone to get hurt because of our action.
During the last dispute we did have a good rapport with the military lads in our area and regularly took them food and drink that was donated to us on the picket line, they seemed to understand and sympathise, and they could see we were genuinely gratefull for their cover for us.
You have to undestand this dispute is only happening as a last resort, the management have got their hob nailed boots on and are stamping all over us.
The so called improvements they are bringing in are nothing more than ways to get at the workforce with bullying, it's not about money and greed.
i would have thought that you lads would understand that you have to fight for what you beleive in.
Sorry Lads but we are up against the wall, Stay safe.
S
sammo
Guest
Instead of bitching about us firefighters trying to better our lot YOU should be trying to sort your senior brass who allow you to be used as porns in this political game
B
Bluntend
Guest
Sammo.
I think its safe to say that most people have put forward an arguement as to why we hold such animosity towards the FBU and no amount of 'It ain't our fault gov', our backs are against the wall' statements are going to change that.
I think its safe to say that most people have put forward an arguement as to why we hold such animosity towards the FBU and no amount of 'It ain't our fault gov', our backs are against the wall' statements are going to change that.
B
Barney mc grew
Guest
They have changed the shifts from two nine hour days (9am-6pm) followed by two night shifts of 6pm to 9am followed by three days off to a stupid system of sometimes finishing work at midnight, starting at the crack of dawn, disturbing the whole household in doing so, when there is no reason for the change in working times. If they want 12 hour shifts what's the problem with 8am to 8pm?
Incurring extra financial costs due to being sent to work at these ridiculous times at stations 30 miles from my usual station.
We have females who have to travel home alone at midnight on public transport which is totally unnacceptable.
Those are immediate problems, but it's the tip of the iceberg really.
Fire Engines being Cut and Stations being down graded affecting public safety(that means yours and my families and friends)
( i know before you say anything the strike is also affecting public safety but a stand has to be made otherwise the fire service will end up like the police and you will NOT get a fire engine when you dial 999 but a number for your insurance form)
Pension rights and conditions being messed around with, pensions i must add that we contribute 11% of our wages each and every month to.
ETC ETC..
Incurring extra financial costs due to being sent to work at these ridiculous times at stations 30 miles from my usual station.
We have females who have to travel home alone at midnight on public transport which is totally unnacceptable.
Those are immediate problems, but it's the tip of the iceberg really.
Fire Engines being Cut and Stations being down graded affecting public safety(that means yours and my families and friends)
( i know before you say anything the strike is also affecting public safety but a stand has to be made otherwise the fire service will end up like the police and you will NOT get a fire engine when you dial 999 but a number for your insurance form)
Pension rights and conditions being messed around with, pensions i must add that we contribute 11% of our wages each and every month to.
ETC ETC..
T
Twonston Pickle
Guest
Why wasn't the latast offer from the Fire Service put to a vote then before taking action? Last resort my @rse!
Oh, as an aside, we cannot take any action against our seniors/politicians for being used as pawns. Apart from the fact that we all have a sense of duty, loyalty and respect etc, we are not allowed to have a union or take strike action, unlike you firemen.
Oh, as an aside, we cannot take any action against our seniors/politicians for being used as pawns. Apart from the fact that we all have a sense of duty, loyalty and respect etc, we are not allowed to have a union or take strike action, unlike you firemen.
B
Barney mc grew
Guest
But there comes a point when duty, loyalty and respect (which every serving firefighter posesses, together with the promise to risk their own life to save others in danger)are pushed beyond the limit and those said attributes are ABUSED by the management.
T
Twonston Pickle
Guest
I assume, Firestorm, that your comment was aimed at me and my colleagues. Let me first correct a few misconceptions you clearly have about the Armed Forces:
1. Free pensions - the Government, on our behalf, contributes a notional 11% to our pensions. We do not see this in our pay, it is automatic. This is a good reason why we are not as well paid as many other public sector works, particularly at the lower ranks (both airmen and officers).
2. Cheap accommodation? Have you seen the sh!tholes in the UK; even asylum seekers cannot be accommodated in some of our blocks! Cheap yes, worthless yes. Moreover, hvae you even seen the tents & cabins we live in overseas, sometimes for 6 months? No Hilton I can tell you.
3. Cheap food? Pretty much on a par with the accommodation; civilianised (read cheap) staff, sh!te food (with some exceptions) and the cost is starting to creep to equivalent levels to civvy street. We also have little choice where to get our meals from as most bases are in the middle of nowhere.
Next time, do some research on our terms and conditions of service before slating us! Remember, 15% of the Armed Forces have done your job the other 85% sustained an increased workload as a result; how many firemen have done our job?
Rant off.
Edited to include the fact that I am writing this in my break during 10 hours of duty so far today (I work 5 days a week every week and this is the norm). I also missed Xmas, New Year and the birth of my brother's first baby whilst in Iraq. We are maxed on Ops and in the UK. 24/7 is starting to actually reflect some peoples working days.
1. Free pensions - the Government, on our behalf, contributes a notional 11% to our pensions. We do not see this in our pay, it is automatic. This is a good reason why we are not as well paid as many other public sector works, particularly at the lower ranks (both airmen and officers).
2. Cheap accommodation? Have you seen the sh!tholes in the UK; even asylum seekers cannot be accommodated in some of our blocks! Cheap yes, worthless yes. Moreover, hvae you even seen the tents & cabins we live in overseas, sometimes for 6 months? No Hilton I can tell you.
3. Cheap food? Pretty much on a par with the accommodation; civilianised (read cheap) staff, sh!te food (with some exceptions) and the cost is starting to creep to equivalent levels to civvy street. We also have little choice where to get our meals from as most bases are in the middle of nowhere.
Next time, do some research on our terms and conditions of service before slating us! Remember, 15% of the Armed Forces have done your job the other 85% sustained an increased workload as a result; how many firemen have done our job?
Rant off.
Edited to include the fact that I am writing this in my break during 10 hours of duty so far today (I work 5 days a week every week and this is the norm). I also missed Xmas, New Year and the birth of my brother's first baby whilst in Iraq. We are maxed on Ops and in the UK. 24/7 is starting to actually reflect some peoples working days.
S
Scoosher
Guest
Listen... You bunch of Douglas Badder wannabees.....
Stop moaning and whinging about Firefighters.......if you want to be a NODDING plodder doing as your told and not having the "bottle" to stand up for your rights or those of your colleagues, dont have the audacIty to tell us.
WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME SOMEONE FROM THE RAF LOST THEIR LIVES...APART FROM PILOT ERROR...OR DUE TO MECHAMICAL FAILURE PROBABLY CAUSED BY YOU LOT OF SO CALLED MECHANICAL ENGINEERS. ( GLORIFIED BUS MECHANICS, DOG WARDENS, COOKS AND SECOND RATE ARMY SOLDIERS.)
SO SHUT YOUR STINKING GOBS....
HOPE THE NEXT ROUND OF DEFENCE CUTS DECIMATE YOU LOT...
Stop moaning and whinging about Firefighters.......if you want to be a NODDING plodder doing as your told and not having the "bottle" to stand up for your rights or those of your colleagues, dont have the audacIty to tell us.
WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME SOMEONE FROM THE RAF LOST THEIR LIVES...APART FROM PILOT ERROR...OR DUE TO MECHAMICAL FAILURE PROBABLY CAUSED BY YOU LOT OF SO CALLED MECHANICAL ENGINEERS. ( GLORIFIED BUS MECHANICS, DOG WARDENS, COOKS AND SECOND RATE ARMY SOLDIERS.)
SO SHUT YOUR STINKING GOBS....
HOPE THE NEXT ROUND OF DEFENCE CUTS DECIMATE YOU LOT...
Scoosher said:
Scoosher, you really don't get it do you? We have no problem with you standing up for yourself, what we have a problem with having to do your job while we are overstreched. Your strike puts people lives at risk, hope you sleep well at night. instead of a strike why not refuse to respond to fire in government buildings and commercial building? Not the home of Joe Public, who pays yours and mine wage from his/her taxes?
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