Permanent staff

[Sospan]

Sounds more like a holiday camp, washing machines in the block ? Whats wrong with the good old Laundrettes ?

Crack on..................DT_Xtremez_09:

Its 2009 old fella get with the script!!!

Back on topic, I am sure you could start a Cpl's club with a constitution that states all perm staff could attend on certain nights.

 

[Downsizer]

Aren't NCOs banned from the props club or has this recently changed?

 

[4everAD]

Theory being that they want to force every one to use one bar, i.e. Props, however this means that NCO's etc would be drinking with trainees, the same trainees you have failed or bollocked.

Didn't think as NCO's we were allowed in Props unless it's a special event i.e Bands playing or Halloween/Valentines etc.

 

[PTR Hoar]

When i was there in july we were allowed to go to the bop nights on a wednesday but that was it. Not surprised Jax's has closed. Barely more than 5-10 people in there during the week and only 4 of us at the weekend!

 

[mad_collie]

Strange, I was drinking in Jax just a couple of days ago. Not as busy as I've seen it in the past (dead), but it was definitely open.

 

[PVRisthefuture]

Strange, I was drinking in Jax just a couple of days ago. Not as busy as I've seen it in the past (dead), but it was definitely open.

Well, you were trying...

Although you are right, it is not busy at all any more. I cannot bear the though of rubbing shoulders with the unwashed AC's in Props, and as they go to Families too, well, where do the grown ups (not saying I am one) go to drown their sorrows, without listening to stupid mp3 ring tones on mobiles?

It's called Tossford for a reason.

 

[Tin basher]

I spent 6 years instructing at Tossford

Off TopicIt was quiet an uneventful evening then I read that. Best laugh out loud guffaw I have had for ages. Didn't know that studes were taught in the Go-Kart club CJ. 6 years instructing your having a giraffe matey. 6 years here I grant you but all that time instructing no way not with you being ex- loath to function and basics. Off Topic

 

[big_d2008]

I don't know what everyones beef is on this subject. GET A GRIP! I have just finished my FT course and a lot of the stuff being written on here is wrong AC's are not allowed to drink at Families with which i agree as they are all cheeky gobby little ****es now! But as the fact that there are cpl's that have a problem with SAC's being in families then think these lads and lassies havre been in the RAF for a few years before they come back do you think the want to go down probs and hang out with the ****! And in all fairness it is the FT's drinking at families every night that is giving them the revenue to be able to have bands ect on once a month now. The super block issue on the other hand there are only enough permenant staff to just about fill 2 of the blocks and i know this as i was living in one of the super blocks across from them gym where the rest of the permenant staff live. Honestly i mean come on your so hard done by ...................NOT!!!

 

[Soon To Leave]

From my experience you're far better off going off-camp for entertainment where rank and trainee/instructor status can be left behind at the gate. There is no shortage of establishments within a short walk of Cosford and Wolverhampton is but a short train ride away.

These civvy companies taking over the bars think they are on to a good thing by having a 'captive' audience. Vote with your feet and prove them wrong. The same goes for 'pay as you dine'.

 

[Dave-exfairy]

If the Perm Staff have a problem with FT's then they need to think again, the FT's have been out in the real RAF and know the score, it's the basic trade trainees that need to learn where the line is.

 

[vim_fuego]

From my experience you're far better off going off-camp for entertainment where rank and trainee/instructor status can be left behind at the gate. There is no shortage of establishments within a short walk of Cosford and Wolverhampton is but a short train ride away.

These civvy companies taking over the bars think they are on to a good thing by having a 'captive' audience. Vote with your feet and prove them wrong. The same goes for 'pay as you dine'.

A good instructor should have no problems with drinking in the same bar as his studes as he will have been fair with them at all times whilst setting an example where and when he can...a good stude should have no problems with drinking in the same bar as his instructor as he will feel as though he has no beef due to his fair treatment and should exhibit some decorum in understanding that his instructor has a life outside teaching him and may not want to go beyond a nod of the head and a 'alright' as you notice each other in the bar...Thats the way I've always played it...its not difficult.

Maybe if this ethos was programmed into the studes lesson package at the start of his course (as I understand some of them really do not have an idea what is right by our terms) then some of the inter-bar animosity might be avoided.

 

[MyShineyAr$e]

If the Perm Staff have a problem with FT's then they need to think again, the FT's have been out in the real RAF and know the score, it's the basic trade trainees that need to learn where the line is.

The FT's going through Cosford have been away from Cosford for approx 18 months. Barely enough time to reach puberty for most of them never mind 'know the score'!

A good instructor should have no problems with drinking in the same bar as his studes as he will have been fair with them at all times whilst setting an example where and when he can...a good stude should have no problems with drinking in the same bar as his instructor as he will feel as though he has no beef due to his fair treatment and should exhibit some decorum in understanding that his instructor has a life outside teaching him and may not want to go beyond a nod of the head and a 'alright' as you notice each other in the bar...Thats the way I've always played it...its not difficult.

Maybe if this ethos was programmed into the studes lesson package at the start of his course (as I understand some of them really do not have an idea what is right by our terms) then some of the inter-bar animosity might be avoided.

Unfortunately there is a conflict, and not always because of bad blood, because not all instructors can maintain a professional relationship. This isn't the fault of the FTs, but some instructors are more interested in being best mates with the FTs thus allowing this 'special' relationship to influence them. I have seen SNCOs on morning muster discussing last nights session in the families completely oblivious to the fact that the FT in question looks like they slept in their uniform.

 

[TrickyTree]

A good instructor should have no problems with drinking in the same bar as his studes as he will have been fair with them at all times whilst setting an example where and when he can...a good stude should have no problems with drinking in the same bar as his instructor as he will feel as though he has no beef due to his fair treatment and should exhibit some decorum in understanding that his instructor has a life outside teaching him and may not want to go beyond a nod of the head and a 'alright' as you notice each other in the bar...Thats the way I've always played it...its not difficult.

Maybe if this ethos was programmed into the studes lesson package at the start of his course (as I understand some of them really do not have an idea what is right by our terms) then some of the inter-bar animosity might be avoided.

...Unfortunately there is a conflict, and not always because of bad blood, because not all instructors can maintain a professional relationship. This isn't the fault of the FTs, but some instructors are more interested in being best mates with the FTs thus allowing this 'special' relationship to influence them. I have seen SNCOs on morning muster discussing last nights session in the families completely oblivious to the fact that the FT in question looks like they slept in their uniform.

There's also another angle to consider. Why do officers and seniors have their own messes and juniors their own bars? In part it allows all of us to be able to relax and sound off about those above and below us without feeling inhibited because they might be at the next table. I taught both phase 2 and 3 in both of my last two tours - in my last tour, following a move of premises, we were forced as staff to share a crewroom with students/trainees (I do draw a distinction - in my mind phase 3 are students, not trainees - so at Cosford that would include those on FT). Anyway the upshot was that while 99% of the time it caused no problem, because a lot of the phase 3 students were our buddies from previous tours, sometimes you had to be careful what you said, because they were listening. I imagine the students/trainees felt the same - in fact I know they did, because they often said so on end-of-course debrief.

I think a separate bar is a good thing.

 

[Vman921]

When I was there on my Cpl FT in Aug 09 we could only drink in Props or the families club as Jax was closed. I think having different watering holes is the right thing to do. Props for Phase 2 students, Jax for FT and Cpl FT with the families for Permanent staff.

Unfortunately with the Civilian catering companies taking over most camps, they want to make their own lives easier by having 1 bar whilst not realising that:
1. Phase 2 trainees are cheeky ****** that at times need a good shoeing.
2. FT and Cpl FT courses don't want to mix with them and wan't to let their hair down.
3. Permanent staff have exposure to phase 2 trainees everyday and wont their own space to wind down.
Voting with your feet wont make a difference as they already have the contracts and they don't give a to$$ about what we want.
DT_Xtremez_25:

 

[Ghandi's Flip-Flop]

The FT's going through Cosford have been away from Cosford for approx 18 months. Barely enough time to reach puberty for most of them never mind 'know the score'!

Erm to be fair to those guys during those 18 months they've probably spent more time on Ops than the entire combined old school mechs. This tends to make most of them mature up a reasonable amount.

And as for your looking a bag of **** comment, then they'd be exactly the same as every person on their FT course since the year dot. Were you a DE per chance. I certainly know I wasn't a shiney happy airman on my fitters course. It was part of the training to be a JT with a chip on my shoulder.