My shirt could do with an Irony!
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OP ELLAMY Gong
- Thread starter techie_tubby
- Start date
My shirt could do with an Irony!
D
da i ddim
Guest
i think all of you should consider the fact the aircrew are flying the tits off the aircraft out in italy, considerably more flying than in herrick, then comes all the maintenance that comes with flying so much, the ground crew are working constantly with nothing more than dinner as their break all day.
it is a lot busier in italy than it is in herick
so stop flapping your gums get out here and then see what its really like, but you are just mt so you will sit in your office being self important just to be awkward
it is a lot busier in italy than it is in herick
so stop flapping your gums get out here and then see what its really like, but you are just mt so you will sit in your office being self important just to be awkward
Ha! Ha! So you're 'busy' and for that you feel you require a gong?
Don't get me wrong, i did Gioia in 97 and got the FY medal. However, at no point did i feel i earned it. Yes, we were 'busy', but we had no threat to life, IED, IDF etc.
It would be nice to get a gong, but please don't say it deserved due to you been 'busy'. It's due because you are supporting an on-going Op.
Don't get me wrong, i did Gioia in 97 and got the FY medal. However, at no point did i feel i earned it. Yes, we were 'busy', but we had no threat to life, IED, IDF etc.
It would be nice to get a gong, but please don't say it deserved due to you been 'busy'. It's due because you are supporting an on-going Op.
No threat to life... Have you tried driving over here? Also having done Gioia in 98/99 the tempo here is a hell of a lot higher, mainly because Tonkas are s*&t compared to harrier/jaguar, but that's a whole different kettle of fish. If the crews qualify then so should the groundcrew and support elements, as without them the crews wouldn't exist.
No different to the Gulf units (and, indeed BZN) whose aircrew can qualify for medals by flying into/over Afghanistan; whereas those at the DOBs (or indeed ACHQ) don't.
It will take a significant rethink if the 'risk and rigour' criteria for it to happen. (Not that the criteria are set in stone as they have obviously been tightened since the days of GSM(Air Ops Iraq) and the various NATO medals for the Balkans that personnel who remained in Italy are permitted to wear).
Boarderlyne
Sergeant
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Oh well, at least I got my UN medal for actually being on the ground and hearing lead things going whizz!
thecookster
LAC
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There is a difference flying over hostile territory and supporting them from afar. I am due to spend 4+ months somewhere in the Mediterranean, expecting to work long days, and I am not expecting to return to something shiny. As far as the driving goes, I have done a tour in Italy before and am fully aware of the Italian drivers, but the same could be said for Norfolk
DT_Xtremez_19:
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Little Tronk
Guest
Does that include the groundgrew and support elements here also working hard!
Heya, apologies bringing up an old thread but just heard last week from Harry Staish that this is happening! Probablyoing to be a NATO medal and the list was 'I think' sent off last month! Though, due to unusual nature of the Op, those who served in the UK who were dedicated solely to Ellamy may also qualify!
Fully appreciate the majority of this may be lies and extravagant rumour, but there's no smoke without fire!
Fully appreciate the majority of this may be lies and extravagant rumour, but there's no smoke without fire!
Two elements here:
First - NATO will if they are to award one (which they have) then who does/who does not qaulify.
Second - even if it is awarded to UK personnel - the UK needs to approve that it it can be worn by UK personnel. This is not a given; but is judged on the same criteria as the award of a UK medal (risk and rigour etc). We had an individual deploy on an EU op that was awarded a medal; however, wasn't allowed to wear it as the medals committee didn't consider there was enough risk and rigour (even though the UK personnel in the UN mission at the same place were allowed to wear their UN medals).
Sorry didn't get the first point, but the second shouldn't be a problem. The UK wouldn't give out a OSM unlike Afghan so no 'double medalling'. As for risk and rigour, the usual examples of those handed to the Herrick & Telic support crews at home are trotted out every time the subject comes to light!
However, those 'support' crews that didn't serve in Iraq or are not serving in Afghanistan didn't/don't get the respective medals whereas the aircrew flying in the op area did. There appears to have been a shift in the way these issues are judged from about 2000. The 'precedents' set by GSM (Air Ops Iraq) and the various NATO Balkans medals seem to have been overridden.
It will be interesting how they see this one and tackle the conundrum that this causes when set against current UK medal policy for those deployed in the Gulf.
If the same 'policies' are applied as are used for a NATO Libya then only those in the Op Area (ie Libya, its waters and its airspace) would qualify - so that would be aircrew overflying, those on the ships/boats involved, the few that were on the ground.
If they permit it to be worn by those outside of this area (Cyprus, Italy, Marham...) then it will be interesting to see the official line why OSM(Afghanistan) and Iraq Medal can't be similarly awarded to those in Bahrain, Al Udied, Oman and elsewhere that support missions flown over the respective theatres.
Similarly for the first point, it is incredibly difficult to draw lines on who qualifies and who doesn't. If an RAF airman deployed to, say, Italy to support UK aircraft flying over Libya qualifies, then should a FAF airman at his home base who supports French aircraft flying over Libya qualifiy? If the French airman does then so - say - an armour who straps a Stormshadow destined for Libya on a GR4 at Marham qaulify? if the armourer at Marham does, then does a chef on the same unit?
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True Blue Jack
Warrant Officer
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The criteria applied by NATO is that the medal can be awarded to all those serving on Op UNIFIED PROTECTOR duties in the Joint Operating Area, so that is all those at Trapani, Akrotiri, GDC and Poggio, as well as those in the waters off the Libyan coast and the few advisors on the ground in Benghazi. The medal may also be awarded to those at other NATO establishments, e.g., Ramstein, who were employed solely on OUP duties.
I haven't yet seen anything to say whether we are to be awarded the medal or not but Snaith's have recently started doing ribbons and miniatures.
I haven't yet seen anything to say whether we are to be awarded the medal or not but Snaith's have recently started doing ribbons and miniatures.
Looks like the medal is coming out after all. Worcestershire Medals Ltd, makers of the Diamond Jubilee Medal, have started to sell the NATO OUP-LIBYA/LIBYE non-article 5 medal stating it has been approved to be worn by UK personnel who meet the criteria ....
http://www.worcmedals.com/shop/338682/NATO---OUP-LIBYA-/LIBYE.aspx
Personnel must have between 23 Mar – 31 Oct 11 completed 30 days’ continuous service or 60 days’ accumulated service under the following circumstances:
(a) Those Forces under NATO command or control, or in support of NATO, whilst deployed in the Joint Operations Area (JOA).
(b) Those Personnel serving exclusively on OUP, whether inside or outside the JOA, under the CJSOR and supported by a formal Transfer of Authority.
(c) Those Alliance personnel serving exclusively on OUP duties in the three HQs supporting OUP: HQ CJTF OUP Naples, HQ MC OUP Naples and HQ CFAC OUP Poggio Renatico.
(d) Those Alliance personnel deployed outside the JOA exclusively in support of OUP.
http://www.worcmedals.com/shop/338682/NATO---OUP-LIBYA-/LIBYE.aspx
Personnel must have between 23 Mar – 31 Oct 11 completed 30 days’ continuous service or 60 days’ accumulated service under the following circumstances:
(a) Those Forces under NATO command or control, or in support of NATO, whilst deployed in the Joint Operations Area (JOA).
(b) Those Personnel serving exclusively on OUP, whether inside or outside the JOA, under the CJSOR and supported by a formal Transfer of Authority.
(c) Those Alliance personnel serving exclusively on OUP duties in the three HQs supporting OUP: HQ CJTF OUP Naples, HQ MC OUP Naples and HQ CFAC OUP Poggio Renatico.
(d) Those Alliance personnel deployed outside the JOA exclusively in support of OUP.
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bluetonic
Guest
'heard a rumour Op Kipion guys are getting a gong too!!
Really dude, you need to let that one go....
Now go get the guitar....
DT_Xtremez_30:
B
bluetonic
Guest
But only the workers DS!!!!!!!!!!!!DT_Xtremez_14:
DT_Xtremez_14:But only the workers DS!!!!!!!!!!!!
You know me BT, I don't give a fvck....
DT_Xtremez_31:However if they are for the workers, it rules out the entire section you were "employed" in....