Pension splitting issues after divorce

[Cheeky-Chopper-Chipper]

Hi all,
Sorry if this isn't the exact forum for this subject but it seemed to be the best bet to me. Hoping somebody can offer some advice here, I know it's not a nice thing to have gone through, but somebody who's been through this could probably help as they've been there, seen it, done it so to speak.
Right, long story short, I've been in the RAF for 15+ years, SNCO signed on for LOS 30, and now going through a divorce after 11 years marriage. There are no children so at least that's one worry less, and no property or savings etc. What I'd like to know is if anybody has had any experience of how my pension my be claimed for if it all gets messy and goes to court. Has anybody been to court to fight for the right to keep thier pension or had a claim against them to split it with a former spouse? I don't know where I stand here, we're both coming out of the marriage with massive debts in each of our names and I don't want to risk losing any of my pension if it comes to it, I'd rather make a legally binding agreement to help with financial assistance now and not risk having to go to court over my pension. Has anybody (or anybody you know) had this issue during/after divorce, and if she does try to claim for some of my pension, how much do you think I could be liable to lose? If anyone has had a claim against them, or lost part of thier pension to a former spouse after divorce I'd really like to hear how things went so I can make a decision on what to offer. I don't intend offering help now only to get screwed over through the courts at a later date so I just need to know what the outcome may be if it goes that far.
Many thanks, hope to get some gen, I'm sure there's plenty of people that have been in this situation in the past.
Cheers

 

[Soon To Leave]

Firstly, you say you both have massive debts. This is significant as these liabilities will be offset against any assets and form part of the settlement. If your partner is in a worse position than you to repay those debts they could be transfered to you in lieu of some or all of any claim against your pension.

You may find it reassuring to know that any outcome should only be based on the value of your pension accrued to the date of your divorce leaving you a further 15 years untouched.

Secondly, does your wife work and/or have her own pension? If so, you could have a claim on hers.

 

[Cheeky-Chopper-Chipper]

The debts are both in our individual names so will be our own responsibility to pay off. Hers amount to around £8,500, plus a further £3,500 to pay off her car (which is in my name!). She did have a pension from a previous job but as she gave up the job and never carried on paying into it it's probably disappeared and now worth nothing. She has no job now and nowhere to live once this is sorted, that's why I'm hoping an offer of financial assistance now will be the best option for both of us. Only problem is knowing what sort of offer to make, and her actually accepting it. Oh, and I'll walk away with about £35K of debt if she takes my offer!

 

[metimmee]

The debts are both in our individual names so will be our own responsibility to pay off. Hers amount to around £8,500, plus a further £3,500 to pay off her car (which is in my name!). She did have a pension from a previous job but as she gave up the job and never carried on paying into it it's probably disappeared and now worth nothing. She has no job now and nowhere to live once this is sorted, that's why I'm hoping an offer of financial assistance now will be the best option for both of us. Only problem is knowing what sort of offer to make, and her actually accepting it. Oh, and I'll walk away with about £35K of debt if she takes my offer!

Are you sure it matters who's name the debt is in when you are married?

 

[Cheeky-Chopper-Chipper]

Yes, found that out straight away from my solicitor, doesn't matter if you're married or not, debt in your own name is your own responsibility legally to pay off. Lucky nothing was in joint names.

 

[Talk Wrench]

Yes, found that out straight away from my solicitor, doesn't matter if you're married or not, debt in your own name is your own responsibility legally to pay off. Lucky nothing was in joint names.

And just for info, if a debt is jointly owned in both names and one party makes themselves bankrupt, the other person becomes liable for the WHOLE debt.

You're in a sh1t situation debt wise and you'd do yourself a favour by getting some proper, free debt advice.

Creditors are much easier to deal with if full communication is entered into at an early stage.

Good luck fellah. As for the pension, I don't know but maybe the FORCES PENSION SOCIETY could help.

TW

 

[Cheeky-Chopper-Chipper]

Thanks for that, as I said there aren't any debts that are in joint names so that shouldn't be an issue. I have been to a solicitor a couple of weeks ago so I'm asuming the advice he's given me is accurate. I don't need to attempt to write my debts off, yes they are big but I can pay them off easily enough, after all, I have this great job lol My other half however has no job, nowhere to live now, and may see writing her debts off as an easy option.
My main concern, and the reason for this thread, was that if I choose to take on my soon-to-be-ex-wife's debts as a clean break gesture I'll obviously have a bit more debt to worry about. Not a problem long term for me as I have a fairly decent wage coming in, she needs the money now, but I really just wanted to know of other peoples experiences as to how much (if any) of my pension might be awarded to her if I don't make this gesture, or if she doesn't accept my offer. Of course any offer would be a legally binding contract through a court so I can remain safe in future, I just don't want to make any offer to her yet without having a rough idea of what I stand to lose either way.

 

[Dixie68]

From when I got divorced: pension-wise she was entitled to a portion of my pension only for the years we were married - I was in the RAF for five years before we married and I did a further ten years. She was only entitled to a portion of the ten years, not the full fifteen. A third of the ten years pension rings a bell (but I could be wrong on the percentage). This was to be paid in a lump sum on the divorce by the way.
I got her to sign away her rights to that by taking a lions share of the debt - most of which was originally hers anyway after she set up a business. She even had loans I didn't know about, but I had to take them on.
Get some good legal advice - I didn't and because of that I got taken to the cleaners. Yes I got to keep my pension but the amount of debt I took on outweighs that hugely, and with my luck I'll die aged 64 anyway!

 

[Cheeky-Chopper-Chipper]

Sorry to hear it didn't turn out well for you, it sounds like it could be a similar situation here as far as the debt goes. We will have been married for 11 years by the time this gets sorted, so a share of 11/30ths of my pension might not be to bad for me. I still don't really want to take that gamble, I'm sot of relying on her desperate situation right now that she will accept a considerably lower sum to be paid off now, in the long run it will work out much less, but having that money right now should be the best option for her.
If she accepts this she could at least walk away debt free and keep her car, have the stuff from the house etc, and I'll walk away just short of £40k in debt. I'm not sure how this would stand in court if it did come to a fight over the pension, surely the fact that her irresponsible spending and reluctance to get a job over the years must stand for something in my favour on any decision they may make.

 

[worthers]

When i got divorced my ex tried to go for my pension we had been married for 7 years and i had been in for 16 years, her solicitor asked for half of my pension but when i pointed out that she was entitled to half of the 7 years we were married this would equate to 3.5/16ths which worked out to be not a lot and too much trouble to go for especially as i had agreed to take on her debts. I came out quite well i paid her £10k and i kept the house and i kept my pension with a clean break order in place she can never come back for anything else. Always try for a clean break order

 

[ailiebird]

I was married for 18 years and when I left the forces it was agreed through the court that she would get 50% of 18/22 of my lump sum and she would be allowed 50% of my pension. can't remember the period of this but my ex wife agreed to waive the pension rights. My only advice is to get it sorted through a solicitor and rubber stamped by the court. Good luck mate.

 

[ItsAbigWorld]

Good luck with how it goes, mate. I'm getting married in 2012... fingers crossed I won't need to bookmark this thread ;-)

Does seem kind of wrong that you could have to give up some of your pension each year, when she coudl go off and win the lottery tomorrow!

 

[Dixie68]

surely the fact that her irresponsible spending and reluctance to get a job over the years must stand for something in my favour on any decision they may make.

Makes no odds I'm afraid

 

[degzey]

I was divorced 10 years ago in Scotland, laws slightly different but I had completed 22 years at that point and we'd been married for 19 years which meant tha she got half of 19/22 of the pension which can to a pension fund for her of £80,000. Although several offers were made to keep it civilised her solicitor pushed for a pension share. With all the negoiations it took 5 years to sort, at the end of the day everything is split 50/50. Ex actually thought though that she was getting a lump sum and was looking at houses right after leaving the sheriffe's court had to laugh at her advice.

 

[amfortas]

A full metal jacket is far cleaner and cheaper.

 

[Soon To Leave]

Are you sure it matters who's name the debt is in when you are married?

I believe all assets belong to you both as do liabilities. That's why she was able to borrow money in the first place (based on household income which is legally half hers anyway). That's also why she can't get benefits. Many wives choose not to work (as do some husbands) that is a lifestyle choice. Any repayments of loans must have have been made by you out of the housekeeping money you gave her (as your 'dependant')
As she is in no position to pay off debts at the moment, it will probably be down to you but allowance will be made for the fact on the assumption half of debts are yours (same for assets) therefore less of your pension should be affected.

Expect the worst and hope for the best as the result could be anything between.

 

[Cheeky-Chopper-Chipper]

Thanks for all the replies here, been away for a few days so couldn't get online. Going back to the solicitor this week to see where to go from here, the one question I have really now is if for example it did come to a 50% pension split based on the years we were married, would it be 10/22 of the current pension as I have now petitioned for divorce, or if she dragged it out for several years would she be entitled to that further portion as well. She could not agree to the divorce so if it came to 5 years seperation as a reason instead of unreasonable behaviour, she may (think she can) get 15/22 instead of 10/22.

 

[Jaymac]

It will be from the date you officially/legally separate.

 

[tigster]

Mememe, i have it on good authority if you empty the bank account's its theft, if she emptie's the bank account's it's theft.

If however you spend the money on say a ferrari, or gold sovereigns(small easy to hide and return to cash at a later date) or a deposit on an abode and rent for as many month's as you are able, just a couple of ideas but im sure you get the jist! then it is not theft and the onus is on her to find where the money went.

Im sorry i am passing on this advice because of your circumstances, i feel for you and hope you can protect yourself.DT_Xtremez_25:

 

[JTforever]

Empty the accounts.