Lack of drivers

[StickyFingers]

Twitter has been on fire lately with pictures of Waitrose shelves empty and now Weatherspoons has run out of Carling due to the lack of drivers due to Brexit stopping EU drivers coming over.

Isn't this what it was all supposed to be about though or am I getting it all wrong? There is a local demand now for drivers so British lads and lasses can get those jobs (At a better salary than before) and we can use immigration to fill those slots from the Euro Mainland?

"Do you have C and C + E?"

"Yes"

"Welcome"

Surprised all the RLC drivers haven't 7 clicked their way out, I bet Eddie Stobart is way better than Leconfield.

Not that it matters, self-driving trucks is gonna screw that industry over in the next 5-10 years anyway.

 

[Talk Wrench]

Twitter has been on fire lately with pictures of Waitrose shelves empty and now Weatherspoons has run out of Carling due to the lack of drivers due to Brexit stopping EU drivers coming over.

Isn't this what it was all supposed to be about though or am I getting it all wrong? There is a local demand now for drivers so British lads and lasses can get those jobs (At a better salary than before) and we can use immigration to fill those slots from the Euro Mainland?

Many of those drivers from the EU and already working in the UK were self employed. With the UK government subbing them with covid bounce back loans, many of them subsequently left the UK and they're not coming back. Many others were furloughed and went home banking a nice bit of cash every month to top up their new salaries in the EU. They're also not coming back.

That's why there's a shortage, nothing to do with the UK pulling out of the EU and more to the point, there's now a shortage of Drivers within the EU itself. Very peculiar.

 

[Rugby-Jock-Lad]

I can't talk about England being properly "Oop North" but there is plenty of food still in the shops. Yes there are noticeable shortages of things that you notice on the shelves but, just like Beast from the East and bad weather conditions, it just means people need to temporarily adjust their eating habits. There are plenty of tins etc on the shelves.

Got my Cat C whilst in RAF but have had NO interest in driving. Does not look like a glamorous lifestyle and companies/agencies need to start looking after their HGV drivers better. Older HGV drivers have been warning of this for ages as they bomb out with deteriorating terms and conditions and regulations making their jobs harder (parallels sound familiar to a certain Ministry organisation in the UK) so Brexit had some affect but not as much as people would make you believe.

Not a Government fan but the message to the HGV companies and Retail Organisations of "Pay better and recruit local" is one I wholeheartedly agree with. And it isn't just the pay but how you look after people.

 

[vim_fuego]

On the BBC website this morning there is a collection of po-faced contributors be-moaning the 'trade'. One of them has just been bumped up to £25ph, which based on a 40 hr week gets you £50k [gross]. That's not bad in my opinion.

 

[Barch]

On the BBC website this morning there is a collection of po-faced contributors be-moaning the 'trade'. One of them has just been bumped up to £25ph, which based on a 40 hr week gets you £50k [gross]. That's not bad in my opinion.

That figure was for a driver tramping (sleeping in cab while on the road), I think the term tramping tells a story !!

 

[busby1971]

Its a bit of crisis but not just because of Brexit, a lot of EU drivers went home due to the pandemic and most will come back once it all settles down, as long as they managed to register before they left, then there's been no training or testing for the best part of a year, the fact that the global supply chain is a little messed up just now means that what resource is in place isn't being maximised.

£25ph is probably a bit of an overshoot, probably where tramping or weekend/nights salaries may land, however, a lot of companies are offering non-consolidated payments which will ease away once things return to normal. Unfortunately the Christmas buildup is already being hit so the press will do their usual panic instilling headlines to sell a few more adverts or, if you're the BBC, provide more justification for the ardent remainers still out there, who still blame everything on Brexit.

At the end of the day being in the EU ensured that Drivers and other low skill workers were kept on depressed wages, which is probably why the logistics industry is about 50% non native, at least now the market is forcing companies to pay a real wage for what is low skill but valuable and worthwhile work, I've been working on a Driver Apprenticeship scheme for my current employer recently and we are hoping to take about 60 people a year off the streets and into a £30k job for life.

 

[norfolkred1]

The total lack of facilities, wages and the waste of space CPC course has a lot to do with why drivers are leaving the road. Industries need to up their game to look after the drivers in general. Drivers park where they can safely but run risk the loss of goods and fuel and in the meantime they are moved off Industrial estates for no reason, with many receiving companies don't like them on their land the night before the drop the following day.

 

[Spearmint]

I earned my Cat C through the RAF despite being one of God's Trades and I did use it at the weekends on/off for a year or so with Driverhire.

None of my jobs were 'Tramping' but the routes selected for me (from Peterborough area - As far North as Manchester / Grimsby and as far South as Bournemouth) left almost no time for fudge factor when you had to squeeze in all activities let alone traffic hold ups or cursory inspections at a Weighbridge. This meant after a few bollockings from Driverhire post Tacho Disc turn in for being over the regulations for hours, you quickly sacrificed your legitimate breaktime and incorporated it into whatever time slot you had at the depot waiting for drop off / pick up - which in turn made a crap job even worse and potentially unsafe.

All in it was bullshit and a job I wouldn't want full time.

 

[foxOneFive]

I left the mob with coach and class 1. It's a crap job. But thought it would be a back up if things got bad. Anyway as got older was prepared to pay out the £100 or so for medical and keep licence current. Then the rules changed again with the CPC. So I binned it.
Spend a week in a classroom? yeah really. Lost licence now......What a shame

 

[GOV1]

Like foxOnefive, I left the mob with coach and class 2 licences.

I have been lucky it seems, I have got myself a little number with a local coach firm doing the school runs and the odd school day trip. Lovely little number with all the school holidays off to do things and stuff.

My employer is superb, I am paid well, they also pay for the CPC courses, medical and the DBS. I just turn up and drive my bus for 4 hours a day trying hard not to hit anything!

One thing that really sticks out is I am one of the youngest there. No body under 50, some are even in their 70’s.

No new drivers in the last few years. Boris and his crew need to bin all the red tape and get the youngsters in. The CPC courses are on average £500 every 5 years and an annual £150 ish for a medical.

 

[norfolkred1]

The Queen paid for all my driving from B to C+E. Hardly used the C+E in the RAF on the Radar Convoys. Left the RAF and did 2 years at Honnington supporting the REGT but since 2010 never used it. Getting close 60 so really cannot see being used again. The cost of the CPC and medical will put pay to that.

 

[muttywhitedog]

I used my resettlement to get my LGV licences. I've done a bit of occasional driving since I joined HMPO, but not very regularly. If I wanted to go back now, I'd have to complete 35 hours of CPC, and get a medical, all at my own cost. At my time of life, I dont want to spend 5 nights a week in a cab, even if it offers £50k, but I am seriously tempted to do a couple of shifts per week - 20 hours at almost £20 an hour is about 20% more than I earn now for 22.5 hours where I have to manage people, projections, output, morale, discipline, customer expectations, sickness absences etc etc.

The only thing that is stopping me really is the reversing - I bloody hated trying to back a 50ft trailer onto a ramp that was 3m in width.

 

[Are El]

Not entirely convinced that the driver shortage is due to Brexit - there is a driver shortage here (NL) too, and the last time I looked we were still in the EU

 

[Oldstacker]

I have a couple of friends who are Class 1's - 1 still drives full time, the other is partially retired (works 3 - 4 days a week), both are in companies transporting perishable foodstuffs. From conversations with them, I would say that the big issues are;

1. Driver facilities, especially for trampers. Once you get away from the motorway service stations some areas are diabolical for overnight stops or even 45 min rest breaks. Even some of the sleeper cabs are not well fitted out. The prospect of regularly peeing behind a tree will not encourage more women into the job and, even on the motorways, take a sniff in the lorry parks - it ain't diesel you will smell.
2. The CPC & training costs - haulage companies generally only recruit qualified drivers & people have to pay to train themselves; in most skilled industries these days companies will recruit trainees/apprentices & put them through whatever courses are required. That rarely seems to happen in haulage.
3. Scheduling - drivers are told where to be & when with their loads, 30 mins late at RDC can mean a load being rejected yet the schedules are often too tight with not enough 'slack' to cover loading delays, traffic delays, DVSA checks etc. Management are trying to sweat their assets & don't like it when schedules fall apart.
4. Rising retirement ages; some driving jobs can be quite physical - Lidl & Aldi shop deliveries, for example, require the driver to unload & move the cages to storage and a cage full of milk is heavy. As you get into your 60's that becomes less comfortable, especially when combined with long hours sitting. Who, at 66, 67, wants to be dragging 30 - 40 cages full of milk around on a regular basis?

Life has been made harder for drivers with no real attempts to address the actual issues - it's not pay (more pay is nice but after a point doesn't compensate) it's not Brexit - that just reduced the available pool of drivers who were papering over the cracks. It's companies' failures to plan ahead & look after the staff they have.

 

[busby1971]

I have a couple of friends who are Class 1's - 1 still drives full time, the other is partially retired (works 3 - 4 days a week), both are in companies transporting perishable foodstuffs. From conversations with them, I would say that the big issues are;

1. Driver facilities, especially for trampers. Once you get away from the motorway service stations some areas are diabolical for overnight stops or even 45 min rest breaks. Even some of the sleeper cabs are not well fitted out. The prospect of regularly peeing behind a tree will not encourage more women into the job and, even on the motorways, take a sniff in the lorry parks - it ain't diesel you will smell.
2. The CPC & training costs - haulage companies generally only recruit qualified drivers & people have to pay to train themselves; in most skilled industries these days companies will recruit trainees/apprentices & put them through whatever courses are required. That rarely seems to happen in haulage.
3. Scheduling - drivers are told where to be & when with their loads, 30 mins late at RDC can mean a load being rejected yet the schedules are often too tight with not enough 'slack' to cover loading delays, traffic delays, DVSA checks etc. Management are trying to sweat their assets & don't like it when schedules fall apart.
4. Rising retirement ages; some driving jobs can be quite physical - Lidl & Aldi shop deliveries, for example, require the driver to unload & move the cages to storage and a cage full of milk is heavy. As you get into your 60's that becomes less comfortable, especially when combined with long hours sitting. Who, at 66, 67, wants to be dragging 30 - 40 cages full of milk around on a regular basis?

Life has been made harder for drivers with no real attempts to address the actual issues - it's not pay (more pay is nice but after a point doesn't compensate) it's not Brexit - that just reduced the available pool of drivers who were papering over the cracks. It's companies' failures to plan ahead & look after the staff they have.

Problem is companies that did look after their staff were undercut by those that didn’t.

 

[Oldstacker]

Problem is companies that did look after their staff were undercut by those that didn’t.

Short term profits at the expense of long term sustainability...... surely not??? I think another factor is that driving was, traditionally, one of the jobs into which recently demobbed military personnel went - either with licences collected during their service or acquired through resettlement training. The shrinking services coupled with changes to resettlement options has probably played a role in this as well.

 

[Talk Wrench]

Short term profits at the expense of long term sustainability...... surely not??? I think another factor is that driving was, traditionally, one of the jobs into which recently demobbed military personnel went - either with licences collected during their service or acquired through resettlement training. The shrinking services coupled with changes to resettlement options has probably played a role in this as well.

Without wanting to create thread drift, the same rationale can be applied to the aircraft industry.

 

[foxOneFive]

I used my resettlement to get my LGV licences. I've done a bit of occasional driving since I joined HMPO, but not very regularly. If I wanted to go back now, I'd have to complete 35 hours of CPC, and get a medical, all at my own cost. At my time of life, I dont want to spend 5 nights a week in a cab, even if it offers £50k, but I am seriously tempted to do a couple of shifts per week - 20 hours at almost £20 an hour is about 20% more than I earn now for 22.5 hours where I have to manage people, projections, output, morale, discipline, customer expectations, sickness absences etc etc.

The only thing that is stopping me really is the reversing - I bloody hated trying to back a 50ft trailer onto a ramp that was 3m in width.

(The only thing that is stopping me really is the reversing - I bloody hated trying to back a 50ft trailer onto a ramp that was 3m in width.)

Mutty: I 100% agree with you. It's one thing reversing on your test that you have practiced dozens of times with little markers everywhere, another thing stopping 2 lanes of traffic with your hazards on trying to get it right 1st time and abuse off waiting traffic.

I left mob 2004 and got my class 1 in 2003 through resettlement. A good mate of mine did, and still does run a 10 driver haulage company delivering animal feed to farms. Anyway, I asked him if I could drive with him for free for some experience, he agreed.

A dark foggy winters morning we arrived and he said "there's the farm track on the right" which was a 200 yrd bendy dirt track with large trees either side and just wide enough for a truck? So I swung it to the right and he stopped me and said "no, you gotta reverse in" Freaked me out, he done it in the end. I would of struggled to do it forward.

I done a couple of years driving trucks for MOD but that was easy compared to the real truckers out there.

I take my hat off to anybody who drives class 1 or C+E as it's called now.....You might think you are a great car driver, but driving a artic is a whole different thing

(The low bridges are another topic that as a car driver we never give it a thought)

And as all above have said: the expense of the cpc and medical has put old duffers like me off it. Not that I would ever have done it again but a bit pi££ed off that I went through all the grief of the driving tests then only to loose my entitlement, because of the bullshit tick boxing

 

[muttywhitedog]

Yes, there were some scenarios that still give me shivers. One was trying to reverse onto a loading bay that was on a slope from right to left. No matter how hard I tried, the trailer just wouldnt go where I wanted it to. In the end, a fellow driver took pity on me and put it on. He was a regular to this particular drop and said that it took him a good few trips before he could get it right.

 

[Spearmint]

It's when things go wrong you as the Driver appear to be the first in line for the blame which irked me somewhat.

I do remember trying to deliver a huge marble garden statue (Invoice in six figures) once at a garden centre. The owner manouvered me into position, I confirmed with him if he is happy with the position to which he replied, 'yes'. Curtains were then pulled to the side to allow access to the statue - stood resplendent and strapped down on it's pallet.

10 mins later he (the owner) came tootling out on this hefty looking fork lift truck and began to lift it out.

It was all going well until the owner placed a wheel directly over a sewer access cover which cracked and gave way under the weight. The forklift dipped, the statue wobbled and the driver tried to immediately compensate by flooring it out of the hole. This threw the balance the other way and the statue fell off, smashing with some force into many pieces.

Fucker tried to blame me for how it was parked.