Met Police Again ...

[Weebl]

I just wish people would see there that are 2 sides to every story and listening/seeing a heavily edited news report with a biased commentary does not make for 2 sides.

That is my point, it does not matter how 'heavily edited' the footage I have seen is (and I am fully capable of ignoring the droning voiceover thanks) the bloke was at that moment in time posing no threat of violence to either the officers or the public, he had his back to them, his hands in his pockets and was moving away. That is what I have formed my opinion on, and no doubt that will form the basis of any investigation into assault.

This Officer will answer for his actions should it be proved that his actions contributed to this mans death. For my mind i'm still of the opinion that he was not as innocent as the media would have us believe.

This is the kind of comment i am talking about, you think he is not as 'innocent' as the media would have us believe. So he was annoying the officers? probably, so he had previously obstructed them and been moved on? looks like it from other video reports. Does anything that had occurred previously provide reason under law for a baton strike and shoulder charge from behind? If it does this country is further in the sh1t than I thought and I will be on the next march protesting at the sudden conversion away from democracy.

I'm purporting to be nothing, I do the job that I do. Would you like me to question you being in the RAF?
I have the experience to know that things are not always as they seem in situations like this.

Yes, feel free. I used the word 'purporting' because this is an internet forum and I don't 'know' you are a copper and more than you 'know' I am in the RAF Stranger things have happened (and people have managed to be quoted in the press as something they are not)

Nobody doubts your experience, nobody denies the Police in this country do a good job (ok, some do but they just like to dribble) The point I am making, and the only point I have made in this thread is that serving Police Officers stating on this thread that he is not all that innocent and inferring 'he probably deserved it' does the public image of the Police no good. Regardless of your protestations saying you are waiting for investigation results, statements like 'he is not as innocent as made out' come across as the Police closing ranks.

Remember, the Police are their to serve the public, not to swat them around at the governments bidding. When that changes I will be among the first on the streets myself.

 

[FeedTheYak]

chiprafp -

I suspect that you are a desk jockey RAF copper who hasnt got a clue what your on about, other than to support your "Real Copper Mates" in the real police force.
You are as biased as anyone on here, and you certainly havnt given an unbiased view in this post.
I AM NOT ANTI POLICE - if I was, I would quite clearly say so.
I do not support coppers who break the law, it grates on me when I see so called Law Officers, setting bad examples to Joe Public.
If its ok for a Police Officer to push someone around, then why cant I do it ????
I dont give a FU__CK what you think, beacause that fact is not up for personal interpretation !!!! ITS THE LAW. So take your whinning stories about what you go through on a nightshift, and stick them where the sun dont shine. If you dont like it, LEAVE or man up.
The problem with the Police is simple, you have total contempt for anyone who isnt "in the job", YOU TREAT EVERYONE YOU MEET AS A SUSPECT and think you can break the law when it suits you, and then hide behind some feeble excuses when you FU__CK up.
I hope this Officer is hung out to dry, because I bet its not the first time this criminal has beaten an innocent person up.
Time to make an example of these BAD APPLES, so that the decent officers out there can have the respect they deserve.
I bet you the Officer involved WILL FACE CHARGES. Certainly dont think they should be manslaughter or anything that serious, but He certainly broke the law and should be punished.
If someone broke into my house, and beat my girlfriend up, and I walked in a gave them a few smacks, ID BE FU__CKIN CHARGED. So there is no point crying about what went on before this man was struck and assaulted.
FACT IS THERE IS NO REASON TO PUSH or STRIKE a defensless, vulnerable man.

 

[R_Squared]

FACT IS THERE IS NO REASON TO PUSH or STRIKE a defensless, vulnerable man.

Christ I thought I could be a self-righteous cnut, but you take the biscuit sunshine.

 

[Vushtrri]

chiprafp -

I suspect that you are a desk jockey RAF copper who hasnt got a clue what your on about, other than to support your "Real Copper Mates" in the real police force.
You are as biased as anyone on here, and you certainly havnt given an unbiased view in this post.
I AM NOT ANTI POLICE - if I was, I would quite clearly say so.
I do not support coppers who break the law, it grates on me when I see so called Law Officers, setting bad examples to Joe Public.
If its ok for a Police Officer to push someone around, then why cant I do it ????
I dont give a FU__CK what you think, beacause that fact is not up for personal interpretation !!!! ITS THE LAW. So take your whinning stories about what you go through on a nightshift, and stick them where the sun dont shine. If you dont like it, LEAVE or man up.
The problem with the Police is simple, you have total contempt for anyone who isnt "in the job", YOU TREAT EVERYONE YOU MEET AS A SUSPECT and think you can break the law when it suits you, and then hide behind some feeble excuses when you FU__CK up.
I hope this Officer is hung out to dry, because I bet its not the first time this criminal has beaten an innocent person up.
Time to make an example of these BAD APPLES, so that the decent officers out there can have the respect they deserve.
I bet you the Officer involved WILL FACE CHARGES. Certainly dont think they should be manslaughter or anything that serious, but He certainly broke the law and should be punished.
If someone broke into my house, and beat my girlfriend up, and I walked in a gave them a few smacks, ID BE FU__CKIN CHARGED. So there is no point crying about what went on before this man was struck and assaulted.
FACT IS THERE IS NO REASON TO PUSH or STRIKE a defensless, vulnerable man.

Your rantings would suggest that you know absolutely fcuk all about the law and even less about the Police Service itself. ...It's as simple as that..

 

[chiprafp]

chiprafp -

I suspect that you are a desk jockey RAF copper who hasnt got a clue what your on about, other than to support your "Real Copper Mates" in the real police force.
You are as biased as anyone on here, and you certainly havnt given an unbiased view in this post.
I AM NOT ANTI POLICE - if I was, I would quite clearly say so.
I do not support coppers who break the law, it grates on me when I see so called Law Officers, setting bad examples to Joe Public.
If its ok for a Police Officer to push someone around, then why cant I do it ????
I dont give a FU__CK what you think, beacause that fact is not up for personal interpretation !!!! ITS THE LAW. So take your whinning stories about what you go through on a nightshift, and stick them where the sun dont shine. If you dont like it, LEAVE or man up.
The problem with the Police is simple, you have total contempt for anyone who isnt "in the job", YOU TREAT EVERYONE YOU MEET AS A SUSPECT and think you can break the law when it suits you, and then hide behind some feeble excuses when you FU__CK up.
I hope this Officer is hung out to dry, because I bet its not the first time this criminal has beaten an innocent person up.
Time to make an example of these BAD APPLES, so that the decent officers out there can have the respect they deserve.
I bet you the Officer involved WILL FACE CHARGES. Certainly dont think they should be manslaughter or anything that serious, but He certainly broke the law and should be punished.
If someone broke into my house, and beat my girlfriend up, and I walked in a gave them a few smacks, ID BE FU__CKIN CHARGED. So there is no point crying about what went on before this man was struck and assaulted.
FACT IS THERE IS NO REASON TO PUSH or STRIKE a defensless, vulnerable man.

Feed the Yak

Luckily I dont care what an angry ranting keyboard warrior thinks of me

 

[John Lloyd]

It seems always to be an emotive issue and polarises opinions, both sides of the argument hold sway from their own point of view.

Scum journo's are employed to sell newspapers and need to 'juice up' the story.

The Police do and will continue to close ranks, that's the nature of any organisation that relies on each other in times of adversity.

The victim, was an alchoholic and one of lifes lower echelon, and probably in the wrong place at the wrong time.

The one seemingly balanced news article is in the Independant on Sunday

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...e-man-who-was-trying-to-get-home-1667554.html

Not because of the statement it makes, but because of the questions it poses.

 

[GD on Wheels]

chiprafp -

I suspect that you are a desk jockey RAF copper who hasnt got a clue what your on about, other than to support your "Real Copper Mates" in the real police force.
You are as biased as anyone on here, and you certainly havnt given an unbiased view in this post.
I AM NOT ANTI POLICE - if I was, I would quite clearly say so.
I do not support coppers who break the law, it grates on me when I see so called Law Officers, setting bad examples to Joe Public.
If its ok for a Police Officer to push someone around, then why cant I do it ????
I dont give a FU__CK what you think, beacause that fact is not up for personal interpretation !!!! ITS THE LAW. So take your whinning stories about what you go through on a nightshift, and stick them where the sun dont shine. If you dont like it, LEAVE or man up.
The problem with the Police is simple, you have total contempt for anyone who isnt "in the job", YOU TREAT EVERYONE YOU MEET AS A SUSPECT and think you can break the law when it suits you, and then hide behind some feeble excuses when you FU__CK up.
I hope this Officer is hung out to dry, because I bet its not the first time this criminal has beaten an innocent person up.
Time to make an example of these BAD APPLES, so that the decent officers out there can have the respect they deserve.
I bet you the Officer involved WILL FACE CHARGES. Certainly dont think they should be manslaughter or anything that serious, but He certainly broke the law and should be punished.
If someone broke into my house, and beat my girlfriend up, and I walked in a gave them a few smacks, ID BE FU__CKIN CHARGED. So there is no point crying about what went on before this man was struck and assaulted.
FACT IS THERE IS NO REASON TO PUSH or STRIKE a defensless, vulnerable man.

If someone broke into your house and you could prove self defence you might get off with it. But in the coppers case he can't,so he is in the poo.

 

[Webbo]

If someone broke into my house, and beat my girlfriend up, and I walked in a gave them a few smacks, ID BE FU__CKIN CHARGED. So there is no point crying about what went on before this man was struck and assaulted.
FACT IS THERE IS NO REASON TO PUSH or STRIKE a defensless, vulnerable man.

No you wouldn't, just ask Duncan Ferguson.

 

[DymondDude]

How do YOU know he's unarmed? Many a copper has been surprised by someone with their hands in his pockets.

Did the video show him with a weapon? No. It showed him with his hands in his pockets. The best anyone can do in that situation is to speculate a concealed weapon. There’s no report that any police officer asked him to remove his hands out of his pockets. So obviously caution is always advised, which is precisely part of the training police go through for that type of situation. So nowhere does it state “attack people with their hands in their pockets ‘just in case’”.

The man is clearly not moving when asked to by the officers, he is clearly dragging his heels.

So? He’s not facing the police off in an aggressive manner. The most he can be accused of – if he even is guilty of anything – is probably mouthing off. Quite frankly if that’s the way that ANY police officer is going to respond then there’s quite a lot more for the public to be afraid of with people in a uniform armed with riot gear.

Is “dragging one’s heels” justification for anyone to barge a man to the floor? Is it acceptable for you or someone you know closely to be barged to the floor for no other reason than arbitrary “feet dragging”? Do you accept that? If not, then why do you accept it when it happens to that guy in the video?

The trick is, for yourself, is not to believe everything you see/read in the media and to read the words of those with more experience, such as Vushtrri and myself.

Why? Were you both there? No.

I’ll go with the video if it’s all the same.

Good job bobbies don't always have bad opinions of members of the Armed Forces. The Police are damned if they do and damned if they don't, policing today is a hard job and the police don't always get the thanks they deserve, maybe you could find that out for yourself if you have the courage?

Courage? There’s nothing courageous about someone who has made their own informed decision to take it upon themselves to have a career in the armed forces or the police. There hasn’t been any conscription. Both police and armed service personnel know the dangers of their careers before they choose to join. No matter how you spin this with your rhetoric and juvenile name-calling of others on here, there’s no justification for any type of action such as we have seen from the policeman in that video.

And if anyone cares, I DON’T support nor condone any aggressions from the side of the protesters no matter how (arguably) sympathetic their and everyone else’s economic situation is if it leads to aggressive, non-peaceful protesting. But the situation is far weaker for anyone of the police force to go using this type of unnecessary force against them in kind. Quite frankly, I’d rather see a million buildings burn down than one death of a living person no matter which side they’re on. When police are armed with any type of weaponry, they have a greater burden of responsibility of their actions. I didn’t see any of that in that video.

 

[Talk Wrench]

Another twist.......

Another twist.......

Another twist in this very tragic case.

It appears that the copper at the centre of the "attack" has himself suffered a heart attack and has been signed off sick.



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-death-signs-sick-following-heart-attack.html



TW

 

[Dicky_morris]

I dont know if i'm just being really thick here.. but say i worked in London, on a newspaper stand.. talking to people everyday.. alot of talk of the earlier riots with people smashing up a bank.. i'm pretty sure in my head i would be thinking.. hmmm best try and keep out of the way of these riots/protests...

so say i was to head home and bump into these protests... again im pretty sure i would either stop/try and find a way around... or possibly ask a copper if i could walk through/be escorted through... to get home.. and im pretty sure i wouldn't be walking slowly through with my head down.. even with if i had an injured leg.. i would bring it to the attention of the police...

i dont know whether the copper was right or wrong to act in the way he did...i dont agree that you should all look at a small piece of video and make a case against him either though.. i think this thread has flown off the handle and too many people are throwing personal insults.. i just hope that **** like this doesnt continue.

 

[Vushtrri]

I suppose it is only a matter of time before some numpty reads the Daily Mule article referring to the officer allegely wearing a balaclava where the reporter then suspects he may be interviewed by the rubber heeled squad.

2 things.....
1...Yet again this is another suposition by the media.
2...It is not a balaclava but an issued item worn under the helmet to assist in protection from firebombs etc

 

[GD on Wheels]

One thing that was pointed out was that he removed his collar numbers off his jacket. Apparently coppers do that so they cannot be identified by members of the puplic. Another ruse is to swap numbers with others so that if their number is reported to the authorities they can say it was mistaken ID.

I leave it to you to make your own conclusions.

 

[R_Squared]

One thing that was pointed out was that he removed his collar numbers off his jacket. Apparently coppers do that so they cannot be identified by members of the puplic. Another ruse is to swap numbers with others so that if their number is reported to the authorities they can say it was mistaken ID.

I leave it to you to make your own conclusions.

I would say that is a collection of very serious suppositions. Do you have any hard evidence to support that potentially slanderous accusation?

 

[GD on Wheels]

I would say that is a collection of very serious suppositions. Do you have any hard evidence to support that potentially slanderous accusation?

Yes you can see on the film his numbers are missing and photos. And from my time talking to coppers it is a practice some do, and is well known.

 

[metimmee]

Funny how in public order situations all officers have their numbers on their helmets really isnt it?

Not as funny as some officers wearing balaclavers on a sunny day.

 

[chiprafp]

I was under the impression all officers in public order gear had their force and number on their helmets somewhere, maybe Dave can confirm that?

 

[chiprafp]

The balaclavas worn are actually flame retardant balaclavas that are issued for public order duties Metimee but then you probably already knew that.

 

[metimmee]

The balaclavas worn are actually flame retardant balaclavas that are issued for public order duties Metimee but then you probably already knew that.

Didnt you read my post - I italicized some. I am sure they are issued and part of the standard kit for public order duties. When the petrol bombs are flying and there are fire all over the place you'd be grateful for any protective equipment that is available.

It may be part of standard procedure, but that doesn't explain why some officers in the vicinity arent wearing them.

 

[GD on Wheels]

I was under the impression all officers in public order gear had their force and number on their helmets somewhere, maybe Dave can confirm that?

If I am right,and I might not be, the number on the helmet is a squad or team number only and not the collar number. And being on the back is not mutch good if they are coming from the front at you.Although saying that you can see small numbers on the front on some.