Should we trust the training of phase 1 recruits to SACs

[rest have risen above me]

After reading the Manning site today I noted a trawl for SACs to become RTS instructors. Now I am in no doubt that there will be some that can deliver the training well, but I question whether they will have obtained the in depth GSK and experience to really carry out the role effectively? Phase 1 training is arguably one of the most important points in a Military career. Discuss

 

[ninjarabbi]

I'm going to hazard a guess that they've run out of volunteers. Personally, and as an ex-instructor I would say no. Any instructor should be of JNCO and above. Unless the SAC has been around for a long time (and you would have to query as to why they haven't been promoted) there is no way they would have the requisite experience.

 

[techie_tubby]

Why would you not trust a SAC? There are a lot of very good 8-10 year SACs with a lot of knowledge that haven't been promoted for various reasons (not all of them the SACs fault). Let me ask you this, would you rather work with a 9 year SAC or a Cpl who has been in 4 years and came off their first board?


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[busby1971]

They are being given SP(AHR) because no substantive JNCOs wish to volunteer, so I'd say isn't a motivated and keen A/Cpl better than a pressed man? Possibly, if the right people. What depth of knowledge do you need to teach people to iron and march anyway....

i would not say it would be suitable at phase 2.

Think you'd need to understand why an SAC would volunteer, wanting to develop the future or on a bit of a power trip, I'll say it first, could be a repeat of the training scandals the Army had in the past, RLC anyone.

For a true NCO roles like these, ie non trade but crucial, need to be given some kind of extra standing on an individuals record, that should sort out the volunteers list.

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[techie_tubby]

If you can get posted in as a newly promoted JNCO I see no reason why a senior SAC can't go in as local acting unpaid.


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[unruly1986]

Surely they should be establishing why volunteers are low and addressing that problem rather than plugging the gaps with lower ranks?

 

[Sniffer]

I have a feeling the forthcoming move may see extra volunteers from the "not wanting to move from Lincolnshire" bunch.

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[rest have risen above me]

If you can get posted in as a newly promoted JNCO I see no reason why a senior SAC can't go in as local acting unpaid.


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Good point well made. I would expect that the criteria maybe should have stipulated on the PSL.

 

[dctyke]

Why would you not trust a SAC? There are a lot of very good 8-10 year SACs with a lot of knowledge that haven't been promoted for various reasons (not all of them the SACs fault). Let me ask you this, would you rather work with a 9 year SAC or a Cpl who has been in 4 years and came off their first board?


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And if they were both in the same trade?

 

[rocket scientist]

I think the term "disciplinary powers" needs to be remembered here.

 

[Stevienics]

I would certaily question the motivation of any SAC who did this to obtain their tapes, which is entirely different from having their tapes and wanting to do this. This is especially true in a P1 heavy duty of care environment.

This is a deepcut waiting to happpen IMHO.

 

[vim_fuego]

Anyone remember what happens when you put a trainee or just newly qualified teacher into the real classroom environment?

Studes can smell the weakness and lack of credibility from a hundred paces...

 

[Witty_Banter]

From my understanding, Instructor tours in RTS are a tough slog (long hours, unsociable working hours, etc etc) which no doubt has something to do with the lack of volunteers. I don't think there would be any lack of drive or commitment from a senior SAC (regardless of trade), but I'm not sure a 2nd tourist would be able to cope with the stress, or have enough in-service experience to be able to deal with some situations. Don't get me wrong, there's always the exception to the rule, but I think it's a role that requires seniority (ie time served), rather than a specific rank.

 

[Stevienics]

If you want the best product, you're going to have to pay for the best manufacturing process. This includes people.

....or as we used to say "S4it in - S4it out"

 

[Flumpdaddy]

If they are good enough to be a A/Cpl instructor surely they are good enough to substantive Cpl so why not promote them fully?

For me as a Cpl there is no incentive to do it. Living in a very expensive part of the country working long hours and weekends for what? And for those who are married you have to drag your family with you, possibly selling a house to buy a box/move into quarters/take on civi rent cost. If you don't take the family then your only going to see them when not required to work weekends.

Hardly surprising they can't find volunteers but there must be a better way of doing it.

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[Flumpdaddy]

If you want the best product, you're going to have to pay for the best manufacturing process. This includes people.

....or as we used to say "S4it in - S4it out"

The RAF hasn't been after the best product out of the training system for quite some time, just the numbers. That's my take anyway.

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[Stevienics]

Hardly surprising they can't find volunteers but there must be a better way of doing it.

FTRS it regionally through suitably reinforced Reserves squadrons? They already in-source all reserves P1 training with the exception of IDT, and that is identical to Regular P1 training, though modularised. If the physical assets exist in a rusticated form, sweat them.

 

[Dazzy26]

Slightly off topic, but this issue is not just relating to volunteer's for Phase 1 instructor duty at the current rank requirement there are lots of posts that the rank range is being expanded to encourage applications. If the selection process works and they are the right people for the job then I don't see a problem.

 

[Stevienics]

If the selection process works

The service has a habit of making it appear on paper to work, in the interests of expediency

 

[techie_tubby]

And if they were both in the same trade?

And? We both know there are examples across every TG of Cpls who should never have been picked up when they did or SACs who should have been picked up.


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