Peers to vote on anti-terror plan

[FOMz]

The House of Lords is expected to vote against government plans to extend the terror detention limit to 42 days.
Opponents say extending pre-charge detentions from the current 28 days is pointless and will damage civil rights.
But ministers say the increasing complexity of terror plots means police need more time to deal with suspects.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7666022.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7447218.stm

Now, I for do not have a problem with detaining terror suspects for 42 days, if it give the authorities more time to build a solid case against them. How many times have we seen terror suspects walk, because the case wasn't strong enough?

 

[firestorm]

None? Can't remember any case to be honest.

 

[FOMz]

Maybe that should have read 'walk , or be found guilty of a lesser charge'

 

[Nec Aspera Terrent]

"Naturally the common people don't want war: Neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, IT IS THE LEADERS of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is TELL THEM THEY ARE BEING ATTACKED, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. IT WORKS THE SAME IN ANY COUNTRY."

Goering at the Nuremberg Trials


Detaining people who have not been convicted of any crime for up to 6 weeks is the top of a very slippery slope. What next? Detain people who MIGHT commit a crime?

 

[Tashy_Man]

The government's plans to extend terror detention limits to 42 days have been heavily defeated in the House of Lords.
Peers voted to keep the current 28-day limit on pre-charge detentions by 309 votes to 118 - a majority of 191.

Full story HERE

Crack on...............DT_Xtremez_09:

 

[MrMasher]

I cant see a problem with it.
Keep em for 28 days and then, as long as there is some evidence in those 28 days, an extension should be applied for to 42 days.
Lets be honest, they arent arrested on a whim are they?
What annoys me is when the lesser charges are given like those 5 that planned to blow up airlines with liquids.
How on earth did they get away with that seeing as they stuck videos on the net of them telling us what they intended to do? And then have a house full of materials for making the stuff.

 

[grumpyoldb]

28 days then show them the door........................fcuk european law.
If you don't like it here..................fcuk off somewhere else.

Aussies have the right attitude...............in my humble opinion, of course.

 

[True Blue Jack]

I've been against the 42 day detention from the start. We already have the longest pre-charge detention limit in the world, by some considerable margin (Australia is 2nd with 12 days). No terrorist suspect has been released because the 28 day limit was reached, not even close.

From what I've read in the newspapers, terrorists that have been let off or found guilty of lesser charges have been the 'beneficiaries' of errors in policing.

 

[Nec Aspera Terrent]

I cant see a problem with it.
Keep em for 28 days and then, as long as there is some evidence in those 28 days, an extension should be applied for to 42 days.
Lets be honest, they arent arrested on a whim are they?
What annoys me is when the lesser charges are given like those 5 that planned to blow up airlines with liquids.
How on earth did they get away with that seeing as they stuck videos on the net of them telling us what they intended to do? And then have a house full of materials for making the stuff.

Sure about that?

A Brazilian electrician was shot dead because he looked a bit shifty.

Anti-terror monitoring laws have been used to spy on parents trying to get their kids into better schools.

The government has used anti-terror laws inappropriately in the current financial crisis. Who's to say they wouldn't abuse these powers if they ever become law?

Thankfully the Lords have sent a clear message to Brown and his freedom eroding government.

 

[MrMasher]

Sure about that?

A Brazilian electrician was shot dead because he looked a bit shifty.

Anti-terror monitoring laws have been used to spy on parents trying to get their kids into better schools.

The government has used anti-terror laws inappropriately in the current financial crisis. Who's to say they wouldn't abuse these powers if they ever become law?

Thankfully the Lords have sent a clear message to Brown and his freedom eroding government.

Thats all well and good, but back to detaining people:

I'd rather they detain people for longer if needed. It might pi55 people off but I'd hate to see someone released who shouldnt have been.
Especially if they vanish only to reappear when they have blown themselves to smithereens in a crowded public place.
Just my humble opinion, which is usually wrong anyway!DT_Xtremez_28:

 

[Tashy_Man]

Just my humble opinion, which is usually wrong anyway!DT_Xtremez_28:

Slightly Off Topic but how can YOUR opinion be wrong ?

Crack on................DT_Xtremez_09:

 

[gemarriott]

This might surprise some people but I am dead set against this government having the right to bang people up without a trial on terror charges for 42 days. They cannot be trusted to use this only for the cases were it may be desirable. FFS they have used anti terror laws to police what we put in our bins! I wouldn't put it past these morally deficient meglomaniacs we have given power over our lives to use this to lock up dissenters.

 

[Scaley brat]

This might surprise some people but I am dead set against this government having the right to bang people up without a trial on terror charges for 42 days. They cannot be trusted to use this only for the cases were it may be desirable. FFS they have used anti terror laws to police what we put in our bins! I wouldn't put it past these morally deficient meglomaniacs we have given power over our lives to use this to lock up dissenters.

Quite so gem, I guess we have one more year to find out if Britain is still a free country. Next year Brownski can invoke the parliament act and make it law whether we like it or not......

 

[True Blue Jack]

Next year Brownski can invoke the parliament act and make it law whether we like it or not......

Only with the support of his own backbenchers and the DUP. It won't happen.

 

[Ex-Bay]

"Naturally the common people don't want war: Neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, IT IS THE LEADERS of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is TELL THEM THEY ARE BEING ATTACKED, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. IT WORKS THE SAME IN ANY COUNTRY."

Goering at the Nuremberg Trials


Detaining people who have not been convicted of any crime for up to 6 weeks is the top of a very slippery slope. What next? Detain people who MIGHT commit a crime?

All too frighteningly true.

The leading Peer has advice Gordo to drop the thing cos' there's no way he's going to win !


DT_Xtremez_32:

 

[FOMz]

I'm all for it. Why not send a message out, come here and fcuk with us - we'll fcuk with you. We did it in Princess Gate back in May 1980 and no terrorist fcuked with us for quite a while. Memories fade and I think we need to send a clear message out to those who wish us harm.
If you've done nothing wrong, what have you got to worry about. Some people seem to think that this will mean innocent people hauled off the streets and taken to the darkest place in the British isles for water boarding and god knows what else..
Its needed to allow the Police and Security Services the time they require not only to build a case against, but ensure yours and the nations safety.
We are in this situation thanks to 30-40 years of liberalised immigration policies and when things need to change, even if it is unpalatable for some, they need to change.

It makes me wonder, if we had a Tory government - would some of you still feel the same? I think not.

Look past the politico's..

 

[gemarriott]

Sorry mate I cannot agree with you. We have a government prepared to lock people up for putting the wrong stuff in rubbish bins using anti terror laws, a government who one day apply sanctions to Iceland under terrorist laws for banking malpractice and then the next day gives them 100 million. Yet you want to let them have the right to lock people up for 6 weeks without charges? Sorry not until we get politicians we can trust not to abuse the power and I include Cameroons shower in that statement.

 

[FOMz]

No, I want the police and security services the RIGHT to apply for 42 days detention for terror suspects and have the correct framework in place to allow them to do that....

 

[firestorm]

FOMZ-"If you've done nothing wrong, what have you got to worry about."

Being locked up for 6 weeks without being charged?

 

[FOMz]

A very simplistic view there FS. We're not talking about the man on the street here, we're talking about the terror suspects like the latest batch who have just got off on a lesser charge.

Why tie the hands of the police and the security services behind their backs even more than they currently are.