German GP Hockenheim Preview

[propersplitbrainme]

Vettel still has a lot to learn, gets obsessed with squeezing Alonso onto the rail off the line and lets Massa sail through with Alonso passing him as well.
As for the switcheroo, well its the most useless rule in the entire book isn't it? The instruction to Massa from Rob Smedley was absolutely clear in its intention, and the short-shift Felipe did coming off the hairpin to let Fernando through told the whole world what was going on. Will anything happen? Nah!
Still, it closes things up at the top of table and makes things interesting going into the next round.

Hehe, its also got old Eddie Jordan hopping mad too!

And what will Domenicali do with Rob Smedley who clearly gave the game away?

 

[rest have risen above me]

A little off topic, but the PR Frauleins were very decorative.

 

[Jrids]

Ferrari cheating again..

Fcuking Alonso..

You forget he's not able to do it without the team orders, he's a cheating B*****d.

cup of corrrfeee

 

[Killer Queen]

Apologies for the earlier typo some what wound up.

Stefano is in the doo doo otherwise i hate to say this Ferrari International Assistance!

right where is the JD

 

[I Look Like Kevin Costner]

No, Alonso is "Ridiculous.."

Massa knows where he stands now..

 

[theladf]

A sham result in a sham sport? for proper racing BBC2 22.00 tonight Moto GP from Laguna Seca!!!!!!DT_Xtremez_19:

 

[propersplitbrainme]

OK, Eddie Jordan did well to get Domenicali to talk to the BBC, but haranguing him like he did doesn't help anyone.

 

[rest have risen above me]

I can see both sides to the argument.
There is a fundamental conflict of interests when you are running a team championship and a driver championship. Although you could argue that the team points would have been the same whichever way they finished, "The team" will always want the championship winning driver as well, as it assists with a lot of the money matters that go on in the background.

 

[Dave-exfairy]

On the bright side, Lewis is still leading the Championship

1 GB L Hamilton 157
2 GB J Button 143
3 Aus M Webber 136
4 Ger S Vettel 136
5 Spa F Alonso 123
6 Ger N Rosberg 94
7 Pol R Kubica 89
8 Brz F Massa 85
9 Ger M Schumacher 38
10 Ger A Sutil 35

 

[Rack Shelf Bin]

Cheating Alonso

Cheating Alonso

From the rule book

39.1 Team orders which interfere with a race result are prohibited.

Disqualify Alonso, warn Ferrari with future conduct.

 

[Hammer and stillson]

But as they didnt come out and say move over and let him pass how are they going to enforce the rule? Not supporting it just asking how they can be caught.

 

[mild mannered janitor]

From the rule book

39.1 Team orders which interfere with a race result are prohibited.

Disqualify Alonso, warn Ferrari with future conduct.

surely masa should be disqualified aswell for following the order DT_Xtremez_21:

 

[I Look Like Kevin Costner]

"Can you confirm that message?" & "Sorry".. I would have them in front of the stewards. Massa did not accelerate out of the corner until Alonaso was passed him. Telemetry would say the same. Punish them both with a penalty and it gives a clear message. There are ways of doing team orders covertly.. This wasn't.

 

[Rack Shelf Bin]

surely masa should be disqualified aswell for following the order DT_Xtremez_21:

Maybe a fairer route would be a time penalty for Alonso.

The diaqualification of Alonso may be a bit draconian but it would promote Masa to the position he would/might have finished in.

I think the loser in this is Ferrari with their clear manipulation of the rules and loss of credibility.

 

[Killer Queen]

Appears the Stewards are now going to investigate. Good but toooo late

 

[grumpyoldb]

Ferrari team bosses have been summoned to see the German Grand Prix stewards following the team orders controversy at Hockenheim.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85539

 

[propersplitbrainme]

I think the loser in this is Ferrari with their clear manipulation of the rules and loss of credibility.

Loss of credibility? Hmm, this is Ferraris' modus operandi and has been since time immemorial. They manage to manipulate the meaning of every last full-stop in the rule book in order to gain an advantage and to be fair they are damned good at it. A few years ago they ordered Schumacher to serve a drive-through penalty on the last lap of the race (at Silverstone I think it was) so he crossed the line in the pit lane but also in the lead and he won the race. Nothing in the rules said you couldn't do that but nobody else would have thought of it!
Here they are as guilty as a puppy sat next to a pile of poo that nobody saw it dump, of issuing team orders. They know it, the other teams know it, the viewing audience know it and the FIA know it. But nobody is going to be able to prove that Massa gave up the place under team orders. He just did so after certain words were said in a terse tone of voice and of course everyone at Ferrari has now got their stories connected up and can look the FIA in the face and say 'team orders? us? Nah Governor'

 

[Rack Shelf Bin]

I think Ferrari will get away with it, Massa said on TV that it was HIS decision to let Alonso through.

 

[Stevienics]

Loss of credibility? Hmm, this is Ferraris' modus operandi and has been since time immemorial. They manage to manipulate the meaning of every last full-stop in the rule book in order to gain an advantage and to be fair they are damned good at it. A few years ago they ordered Schumacher to serve a drive-through penalty on the last lap of the race (at Silverstone I think it was) so he crossed the line in the pit lane but also in the lead and he won the race. Nothing in the rules said you couldn't do that but nobody else would have thought of it!
Here they are as guilty as a puppy sat next to a pile of poo that nobody saw it dump, of issuing team orders. They know it, the other teams know it, the viewing audience know it and the FIA know it. But nobody is going to be able to prove that Massa gave up the place under team orders. He just did so after certain words were said in a terse tone of voice and of course everyone at Ferrari has now got their stories connected up and can look the FIA in the face and say 'team orders? us? Nah Governor'

Reasonable premise is surely enough. After all, to whom are Ferrari going to complain if they get penalised? Who will even listen to them?

 

[mild mannered janitor]

Maybe a fairer route would be a time penalty for Alonso.

The diaqualification of Alonso may be a bit draconian but it would promote Masa to the position he would/might have finished in.

I think the loser in this is Ferrari with their clear manipulation of the rules and loss of credibility.

If Masa wanted the win that badly he would have taken it fair and square not bowed to team orders. disqualify them both, team orders are not allowed ! surely following them to the detriment of your resut is as bad as gaining a place because of them?.
like i said if Masa really wanted the win he would have just ignored the order.