Afghan LOA

[CashMachine]

New System?

New System?

4. You would have to do your job, which if it hade all been done and monitered correctly in the first place we would'nt be here. The system shoudl have prevented this, however with any new system them are transision problems and this is one of those..

When I initially started this thread it was not intended to turn into a trade bashing "square go" however I can't let comments like this slide by! Correct me if i'm wrong but by Easter this year JPA will have been with us for 4 years and you're trotting out this pony as an excuse.

Mr Busby, as the self appointed defender of the Admin realm, could you tell us all when the transition period will be over and you're comrades will start to get things right?

Thank you in advance for what will no doubt be a witless retort littered with spelling mistakes, **** poor grammar and a pig headed refusal to accept that a member of the realm could be to blame for this clusterfcuk.
DT_Xtremez_42:

 

[Crusher]

Hmm, I recall a touring JPA Roadshow brief in the run-up to the JPA debacle (2006?) with myriad weary souls at which I asked '...when can 'we' expect PSF to become HR...' My contribution was poo-poohed from the stage as unlikely - whereupon within two months it became so and a lot of good scribes got the heave-ho to shiny heaven.

I suppose that it takes good days and bad days to make up a career, but hats off to anyone that has experienced such a misguided, misled, mis-planned and bull-necked but vacuous venture in their trade back-yard for so long - and remain publicly content with it. May God bless their epitaph.

 

[ninjarabbi]

Crusher, that's the first apology I've had in 27 years, I'm tearing up here! Wait a minute 'senior?'. Did you just call me old, you ****!DT_Xtremez_25:

 

[Crusher]

Bathe in it. Other than those I've extracted by (promised or actual) violence there are usually so few apologies around. In thirty years I never worked for them so was rarely disappointedDT_Xtremez_19:

Too late to embrace that strategy? There's usually their coffee cup, tool-tags, diggers, flight bag contents, JPA log-in detail, telephone earpiece, accommodation door handle etc, etc to wreak one's revengie upon:0

Failing that, getting the moment right to 'coco-pop' them retrieves a perspective.

 

[busby1971]

Forum

Forum

When I initially started this thread it was not intended to turn into a trade bashing "square go" however I can't let comments like this slide by! Correct me if i'm wrong but by Easter this year JPA will have been with us for 4 years and you're trotting out this pony as an excuse.

Mr Busby, as the self appointed defender of the Admin realm, could you tell us all when the transition period will be over and you're comrades will start to get things right?

Thank you in advance for what will no doubt be a witless retort littered with spelling mistakes, **** poor grammar and a pig headed refusal to accept that a member of the realm could be to blame for this clusterfcuk.
DT_Xtremez_42:

This is an unofficial forum and I fear not the spelling nor the grammar police, they have their place and are normally found hanging around the recruitment forum on the lookout for text speak. If you didn't expect it to become a trade bashing thread then you've not been around here long, I think another has just been started.

At no point have I defended the actions of whoever created so many mistakes and much general unhappiness. JPA is always in a state of transition, the Admin world constantly shifts with new rules leaked out and processes adopted. What is noticeable is the lack of responsibility individuals have when it comes to checking their own pay, quick to blame others but not to admit one iota of culpability.

Anyway can't stop now I'm in the Prius.....

 

[R_Squared]

...... What is noticeable is the lack of responsibility individuals have when it comes to checking their own pay, quick to blame others but not to admit one iota of culpability......

That took some front to say, you have a fully functioning irony gland. DT_Xtremez_42:

 

[True Blue Jack]

...could you tell us all when the transition period will be over and your comrades will start to get things right?

It will be over when all of us, both within and without TG17, realise that personal admin is now a personal responsibility. We may not like it (I certainly don't) but it is a fact. Please remember that TG17 took a 30% cut in manpower to pay for JPA. With the best will in the world we no longer have the capacity to provide the service that the great unwashed expect of us - although many still try.

 

[The Masked Geek]

Please remember that TG17 took a 30% cut in manpower to pay for JPA.

A saving which was wiped out by the move to the higher payband.

 

[True Blue Jack]

A saving which was wiped out by the move to the higher payband.

Ironic, isn't it? Without JPA we would still have enough clerks to do the job that is expected of them and they would still be on the lower pay band. Everyone would be happy! We don't, they aren't, let's move on.

Back on topic: Somebody (more likely, somebodies) unknown fcuked up and people were paid money to which they weren't entitled. That money is now to be recovered. Who is to blame? The individual(s) (who may or may not have been adminers) who input the data into JPA and The recipients who have an obligation to know what their pay should be but either didn't know, didn't care, or kept their mouths shut and hoped they weren't caught out. More importantly, what is being done to ensure this debacle isn't repeated? Now that is the $64000 question!

 

[Oberon305]

Correct me if i'm wrong but by Easter this year JPA will have been with us for 4 years and you're trotting out this pony as an excuse.

DT_Xtremez_42:

I'm going to have to come to the admin trade's defense here.......we've had LITS in the Eng/Supply trades for 15-odd years now and that is an IT-based system that is far from perfect and is prone to cock-ups, so maybe the shineys should be cut some slack????

On the other hand, i'll freely admit that I have messed up with the inputting of data onto LITS in the past, which could have serious consequences if not spotted early.

Any IT-based system is only as accurate and reliable as the human that inputs the data onto it. I'm sure most engineers/suppliers/squippers etc would admit to have having messed-up on their systems in the past and would admit responsibility for said mess-up.

So.....over to you guys???? DT_Xtremez_30:

 

[The Masked Geek]

More importantly, what is being done to ensure this debacle isn't repeated? Now that is the $64000 question!

1. Hopefully the "HR professional" that fcuked up will be assraped.

2. More effort will be made to ensure that people out in the Stan can access their JPA to see if they've been overpaid or not. Maybe then we can take some responsibility.

That would be my starter for 10.

 

[shiny_arse]

Off Topic with regards to the question of LOA, but can I put some facts in place!

Firstly, I agree that some clerks are not worth their weight in sh1t, but is that not the case in most trades?

Secondly - yes there should be some type of accountability for when admin does fcuk up someones wages - there a shiny agrees!

Right now that's out of the way - what happened to the admin world and what has gone wrong?

Those with more than 4 years experience will remember when the golden days where most SHQ's had a PSF to deal with pay & movements, manservs to deal with appraisals & establishments and allowances to deal with claims & expenses. Plenty of personnel with experience in their relevant areas.

Then that stupid fcuking IT system arrived and the useless cnuts at the top thought "oh yipee - everyone can sort out their own admin so lets get rid of some personnel!"

So after the majority of the trade got wiped out, those that were left were suddenly and immediately deigned to be experts in PSF, Manservs & Allowances. On top of that it was decided that everythings was to be tri-service to ensure equality through the forces hence a bunch of new procedures that varies from camp to camp, let alone within the services.

Lets not forget as well the other varied amount of roles that admin were introduced to within the A1 role.

Then all the rules and regs were to be adjusted constantly with no de-facto regulations set in stone to be the constant reference for one and all. (ah the good old AP33932)

Oh ! and also don't forget that wonderful set-up that your admin dept can't actually find out something for you as you first have to speak to a bunch of civvies at a call centre first.

NO FCUKING WONDER THINGS HAVE BEEN AND ARE FCUKED UP!!!

"The above might be no excuse" some of you are going to bleat straight back. But just bear in mind that it's not always admin playing around with JPA.

I've heard rumours that some army regiments do not let their Juniors on the system. Just the other week I had to show an Army Sgt how to put a leave pass onto the system.

In summary - admin (bollox to your HR) is still the same two way process that it has always been. You note that something is wrong, you raise the flag to admin (be it JPAC or PSF)

Any decent clerk worth their salt will bend over backwards to get it fixed. The useless cnuts you will come to know - so ensure that you report them upwards if there is no satisfactory outcome to your issue.

There - I'm done!!

 

[The Masked Geek]

- so ensure that you report them upwards if there is no satisfactory outcome to your issue.

I have a better idea, I'm gonna start charging the cnuts.

I came back from a course and walked into PSF on that day and told SAC Bloggs to change my JPA to reflect the fact I was back. A month later and I'm still being paid GYH. Good grounds for a charge if you ask me.

 

[ResidentEvil]

I'm going to have to come to the admin trade's defense here.......we've had LITS in the Eng/Supply trades for 15-odd years now and that is an IT-based system that is far from perfect and is prone to cock-ups, so maybe the shineys should be cut some slack????

On the other hand, i'll freely admit that I have messed up with the inputting of data onto LITS in the past, which could have serious consequences if not spotted early.

Any IT-based system is only as accurate and reliable as the human that inputs the data onto it. I'm sure most engineers/suppliers/squippers etc would admit to have having messed-up on their systems in the past and would admit responsibility for said mess-up.

So.....over to you guys???? DT_Xtremez_30:

I think everyone whohave used LITS have messed up with inputting data at some point - I know I definately have, but its also a question about how quickly you spot the problem and sort it out.

I do agree that any IT based system is prone to 'cock-ups' but at some point someone needs to accept responsibility.

Someone accepting responsibility and saying sorry for their mistake goes a long way.

 

[Goatherdingsplitter]

Off Topic with regards to the question of LOA, but can I put some facts in place!




So after the majority of the trade got wiped out, those that were left were suddenly and immediately deigned to be experts in PSF, Manservs & Allowances. On top of that it was decided that everythings was to be tri-service to ensure equality through the forces hence a bunch of new procedures that varies from camp to camp, let alone within the services.

Lets not forget as well the other varied amount of roles that admin were introduced to within the A1 role.

Then all the rules and regs were to be adjusted constantly with no de-facto regulations set in stone to be the constant reference for one and all. (ah the good old AP33932)


NO FCUKING WONDER THINGS HAVE BEEN AND ARE FCUKED UP!!!

Been there & done it; in TG1 we call it Multi Skilling which started way back in the 60s when we still had eight aircraft trades.

Your experiences are also not unique in terms of constantly changing regs. JAP 100A 01 springs immediately to mind, not to mention all the other babies that seem to get thrown out with the bathwater on the never ending stampede to jointeryDT_Xtremez_35:

 

[shiny_arse]

I have a better idea, I'm gonna start charging the cnuts.

I came back from a course and walked into PSF on that day and told SAC Bloggs to change my JPA to reflect the fact I was back. A month later and I'm still being paid GYH. Good grounds for a charge if you ask me.

I would agree with you 100% there especially as you had made a point of saying that you were back.

Tis the individuals that come in and whinge that they are not getting paid this or that and you discover that they have been away to Cosford 3 months prior and not thought to say owt that used to grip me!

 

[Oberon305]

Do it!!!! It can be a test case. Post the outcome on here and watch the floodgates open!!!!DT_Xtremez_14:

 

[NATOStandard]

I have a better idea, I'm gonna start charging the cnuts.

I came back from a course and walked into PSF on that day and told SAC Bloggs to change my JPA to reflect the fact I was back. A month later and I'm still being paid GYH. Good grounds for a charge if you ask me.

Do it, I'm laughing my Moobs off just reading that one. I'm sure it would brighten your Chf Clk and your P1 sections day.

 

[True Blue Jack]

You know what? I think it's a brilliant idea. I'm not a P1 specialist but I think MAA is probably more appropriate than a formal charge, however, it will serve to highlight the areas of concern and (in theory at least) will result in an improved service.

Obviously there will be a backlash as Chf Clks bring the same sort of action against people who have failed to notify PSF that they have returned to unit, or that they have moved house or whatever. But fair's fair, right?

 

[rest have risen above me]

You know what? I think it's a brilliant idea. I'm not a P1 specialist but I think MAA is probably more appropriate than a formal charge, however, it will serve to highlight the areas of concern and (in theory at least) will result in an improved service.

Obviously there will be a backlash as Chf Clks bring the same sort of action against people who have failed to notify PSF that they have returned to unit, or that they have moved house or whatever. But fair's fair, right?

Here we go.... "My Dad's bigger than yours.... And I'll get my dead hard cousin from P1 to charge you coz he can.... Ner Ner Ner Nerner"DT_Xtremez_14: